No note. Defensive wounds on his hands, where he tried to fight off his attacker. Supposed to not be found for weeks where clues would have been tough to piece together. Arranged plea deal. Dead four days before he had turn over a list of names. They had been coming after him ever since he took the plea deal because they knew he would have to name names. I wrote about that pressure before. He bought most of his photos. One person who was feeling the heat was this former A+ list mostly television actor. As far as I know, he didn't sell him the photos, but apparently many of them came from his collection. The person that was feeling the most pressure and had the most to lose was an A list producer. Their high and mighty world would have come crashing down. There is no way he was going to let that happen. He has big big friends in that A+ list ringmaster and others who can get things done.
Mark Salling
ReplyDelete/Charlie Sheen the pig
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteNot sure about being called just a Producer but Spielberg/Geffen for last scumbags
Delete+all the points Tricia
DeleteArnon Milchan
DeleteThis seems like a pretty big freaking deal. Does anyone think this news will eventually come out?
ReplyDeleteWonder who the producer is...
ReplyDeleteRyan Murphy I think.....
DeleteDefensive wounds and they're still calling this a suicide?
ReplyDeleteThere is no proof that what they're saying is true. How would they know there are defensive wounds? Autopsy isn't even out. I feel like they're saying this because they know they can always claim the coroner lied if it never shows up in the autopsy. Total bullshit.
DeleteSurely his lawyer has the names,probably where Enty got the info.
ReplyDeleteSo he wasn't supposed to be found hanging in a park for weeks?
ReplyDeleteThe initial reports made it sound like it was out in the open but if you look at pictures it looks more remote. The timing makes no sense given the facts of the case.
DeleteMy thoughts too ... Public Park in a place where weather is good primarily throughout the year. No reason that he wouldn’t of been found rather quickly.
DeleteMaybe they were supposed to out the body somewhere else but something in the plan went awry
DeleteThe news report I read was that it was a fluke he was found so quickly, so it must of been off in the bushes and trees, maybe in a ravine, something. But if it's true, this is heartbreaking that he would be murdered. I believe it.
DeleteIt’s like a ravine, and the trees are too slim there to be any kind of reasonable choice for hanging with a noose. When I saw where it happened I wondered if he had actually jumped and landed on the trees (hanging from as in draped over branches).
DeleteThe canyons in the mountains and hills around LA are a well known location for body disposal throughout the years because they’re so steep and you can’t see into them from the roads. Even aerial photos don’t tell the whole story of “proximity” to a little league field because the key element here is vertical, not horizontal.
The wild animals usually get the bodies before the police do.
@Hanniam
DeleteI too wondred about the trees. They looked like new growth trees among a bunch of bushes. I did not see one tree that looked like one could hang oneself
Yea but that was just the beginning of the trail into larger trees where he could have hung himself from. Common sense tells you that if his dead body was staged to be found hanging from a tree there has to be a tree that was large enough to support his body weight where he could actually hang himself from. He was found hanging from a tree period. Even if you believe it was staged there had to be a tree large enough to hang a body from. The whole area was blocked off by police so what you're seeing in photos is not the actual tree but the beginning of the trail to block off paparazzi and news reporters from the area.
DeleteSounds like you were there in-person, no? I think I e all understand he couldn’t have hung himself from a twig.
DeleteYes you're right I was there this is Steven Spielberg I killed him myself. I'm one of the guesses. Send $500 to my PayPal and you can get two passes to my next movie premiere starring Tom Hanks.
DeleteWouldn't the person who wrote this have to be there to know there was defensive wounds on the body? That's some pretty quick info if you ask me. This was written less than 24 hours after they found his body which tells me one of two things. It's either bullshit or they were there. Aren't you suspicious of that bit of info? My guess is it's all bullshit but since you're a nutter you should be suspicious because only the killer would know those details.
DeleteNot true. Any PO or investigator with any experience would know defensive wounds are typically found on hands and arms.
DeleteYou don’t get defensive wounds from hanging yourself.
They’d be obvious to anyone at the scene with any experience in violent crime.
Leaks happen from all kinds of places. I find it extremely odd that the coroner wouldn’t rule it a suicide.
I believe this and other things will come out. Anyone needing to reveal something needs to do it this year because the karma gods are on the war path.
ReplyDeleteDang. This breaks my heart on so many levels.
ReplyDeleteI don't know man...He was still into child porn.
Delete+1
Delete+1
DeleteMark Salling, Matthew Morrison and Ryan Murphy or Bryan Singer.
ReplyDeleteI thought MM but did he ever reach A+?
DeleteNot in my book. He's slimy looking just like Justin Timberlake. I think it's all connected to Glee.
DeleteGood point, Sunspirit. Don’t forget the downward spiral and eventual suicide of Corey Monteith. Makes you wonder what was going on at Glee.
DeleteCorey Monteith was not a suicide it was an accidental drug overdose. He was a known drug addict.
DeleteCorey Haim?
ReplyDeleteHe hadn't gotten arrested before his death needing a plea deal did he?
DeleteThis screams Mark Saling EXCEPT that his car was found on the side of the road where he took his life.. That's not exactly the way to insure he won't be found for weeks? At least in my mind.
ReplyDeleteDave Grohl hates Ryan Murphy that must mean something...
ReplyDeletehttp://www.celebitchy.com/146414/foo_fighters_dave_grohl_hates_glee_and_ryan_murphy_too/
Agreed. If Dave hates ya, I hate ya!
Deletecomments on that thread were wholly entertaining . I like the one who knits while watching Glee lol
Delete+1
ReplyDeleteTricia needs to run her own LA detective agency, seriously.
Crap. That’s kinda scary..
ReplyDeleteRyan Murphy for producer? Mathew Morrison I am sure is connected too. He is friends with Geffan. Morrison was also reportedly at Singers parties. I know he isnt A+ Id say Sheen for that and agree with Tricia.
ReplyDeleteI found it strange that the first article i read stated his body was found in the LA river, but the next article stated he hanged himself in a public park near his home. Which is it?
ReplyDeleteFuture podcast on Fame is a Bitch
ReplyDeleteHe had plenty of time to name names. They are saying he was going to pay the victims. If there were direct victims, why was he only guilty of possessing indecent images, why not more than that? Terrible plea deal that wasn't going to provide justice, in my non-professional opinion.
ReplyDeleteWell, I didn't want to post my nagging feeling in the groundswell of hatred for the paedo. Loathe paedoes as any sane person would. But honestly, in light of the utter depravity of Hollywood that I now know, my initial thought was that he'd been set up. What if someone sent him those images? I don't know enough about the case and I could be completely way off, but that was the first thing that popped into my head.
ReplyDeleteRead his plea deal. You can find it online. He was exactly what he was.
DeleteDude was a pedo he was not set up. Fucking people why do they have such a hard time believing what is right in front of their eyes? This guy was a suicidal pedi. He wanted to fuck kids and he fucking killed himself because his life and career was all but over. End of story. This blind is bullshit.
DeletePedo
DeleteRight. Life is black and white and one should never ask questions.
DeleteYou can ask questions but this one is pretty easy seeing as how his gf reported him because she caught him looking at child porn so that says he wasn't set up. He also attempted suicide several times before and wasn't successful so there's that. He had few reasons to live and many reasons to want to die so there's also that.
DeleteNo one is arguing he’s a saint or innocent.
DeleteIt’s easy to assume he killed himself based on initial leaks. The responsible thing is to find out why the fuck a guy would kill himself days before he was supposed to give up names of big players that enabled him.
Could be a suicide - but it’s worth actually knowing rather than assuming.
Rosie, you can see the crime scene on Google. It does look a little out of the way and private.
ReplyDeleteThings are looking up, folks:
ReplyDeletehttp://abc7.com/hundreds-arrested-in-human-trafficking-crackdown-in-ca/3007899/
@Samantha
DeleteThat's great news! They just dbled the amt of arrests they have made since the taskforce was formed 2+ yrs ago!
Salling, Morrison and Murphy. This is disgusting. I understand Salling was a POS but that doesn't make this right - they should pay for this.
ReplyDeleteThis twitter post explains everything.
ReplyDeletehttps://twitter.com/JohnDoe78359022/status/951986312168591361
Oh they're paying, more like making payoffs. Lots of people in LA are going to be driving new cars in February.
ReplyDeleteYou would think by now with the sudden onslaught of deaths/suicide days before information is to get out that these folks would have some sort of plan in place in the event something happens to them.
ReplyDelete@filmfanb
ReplyDeleteHoly shit, dude.
Seems Chrishell Stause dodged a bullet with Morrison. She wound up with Justin Hartley instead. #upgrade
ReplyDelete@cheesegrater15 I know, the dots are being joined. Shout out to the person who did all the work
ReplyDeleteThe point of a plea deal is exchange of information. It takes weeks or months to evaluate what a criminal is offering and how much it justifies in sentence reduction. It all has to be cross checked with what was found on his computers (i.e. sources of files etc.). Anything he was giving up was shared long before this.
ReplyDeleteThank you, I was going to ask about this, as I can't imagine they offer someone a deal without seeing the goods they have to offer and vetting them somewhat. They aren't going to deal based on a promise.
DeleteSo is the LAPD/FBI paid off enough not to name the others because the top of the pyramid is that powerful?
Sadly yes I think they can be paid off and happens more often than we all know. With his “suicide” there will be no actual plea deal or sentencing so nothing to be released to the public.
DeleteThe scene definitely looked less "where to leave this mortal coil" and more "where can we stage a body."
ReplyDeleteKillers like strangulation because less mess/blood-splatter.
Except he made a previous attempt at suicide. We don't know for sure there is no note. It is bad enough the man did not face his punishment and caused such horrible grief to his family, but speculating about his death and insinuating someone killed him is just despicable. Is there no common sense and decency anymore? This website has gone to shit
ReplyDelete+1
Delete-1
Deleteback to even,
I got you enty.
+1
DeleteThey're getting more desperate, and desperate people make mistakes. You have to leave the car, because if he didn't have a visible means of getting there, it makes the suicide harder to believe. Around here, a car on the side of the road could sit there for a few days before the cops notice it and tag it, and then tow it after another day or two. If his body hadn't been stumbled over, the car probably wouldn't have alerted anyone right away either.
ReplyDeleteSalling may have thought he was safe because he'd already spilled to the authorities. But as I said in the previous thread, there's a difference between a list of names in a deposition and a witness on the stand pointing fingers. There's also simple revenge. If you go to the cops and spill your guts, that doesn't make you safe -- one reason people hesitate to do it.
maybe it was primarily a message to potential whistle-blowers
ReplyDeleteProducer: Dan Schneider
ReplyDeleteLooking at the location pictures, I can believe his body could have gone undiscovered for a couple of weeks. Except his car was nearby, which is what made them look in the area at all.
ReplyDeleteI also noticed the trees look small for hanging. No branches that could support his weight. For that matter, how did he even do it? What did he stand on to get up and then drop off of?
The car is the monkeywrench in the foul play story, though. It wouldn't have gone unchecked for weeks.
@Sal, the car is more likely to be tagged and towed. It’s probably only because his family called for a welfare check that the police were looking for it in the context of finding Salling.
DeleteThe expectation may have been that nobody would bother to check on someone awaiting sentencing for child porn. They forgot to account for the closeness of some families who don’t abandon their kids even if they do awful things.
@Cail exactly that. And bodies tend to be found scattered by wild animals feeding if found at all.
ReplyDeleteOur canyons are steep and densely overgrown, which is great for the three things they’re known for: accidents, body dumping, and spectacularly awful wildfires.
I thought the same thing about the scene inside the police tape. Those trees are pretty spindly and I didn't see any branches from which you could hang a noose. It immediately brought to mind the Sherman murders in Canada that were staged as hangings.
ReplyDeleteClearly, CLEARLY, not okay even despite the charge of viewing child porn (if it's Salling). This shit needs to be shut down hard and the authorities need to know that if they are protecting the guilty they will go down with them.
ReplyDeleteIf he was due to give over the names how was nobody going to find him for weeks? There would be an intensive search assuming at best that he'd fled.
ReplyDeleteIn the canyons, hungry wild animals usually find the bodies long before the police do, and by then, forensic analysis is typically required to ID the remains.
DeleteI’m starting to think there will be more details on the condition of Salling’s remains (and his ankle monitor) than have been released to the public.
I think Steve means that whoever he was due to turn over names to would have looked for him fairly shortly, at which time the tagged & towed car would have shown up in the system.
DeleteHH314, in this case,there is reason to speculate,the deal he made raised eyebrows,especially when you see the details. He had to have given up names, and someone correct me if I am wrong, should have had an ankle monitor. There is a lot of reasons to believe people like this will stop at nothing, this isn't just the neighborhood creep. I won't speculate on the names yet,but the usual suspects are out there, and someone needs to get the the people who profit from this. Justice isn't achieved by jailing a c list celebrity, it just gives an illusion something was done.
ReplyDeleteSalling committed suicide for less time than Barry Sherman did!
ReplyDeleteIf this is a conspiratorial murder, the truth will never come out if the LA Medical Examiner's Office is falsifying autopsy reports.
ReplyDeleteWhen the fuck is the levee gonna break? How many people have to die in fake suicides? How many coverups? It's fucking maddening to read this shit and then go on about your day.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDelete"should have had an ankle monitor"
ReplyDeleteNot necessarily. He wasn't being held on bond at this point, having already pled out. They might not have ever put on an ankle monitor as it seems Salling was immediately willing to cooperate.
"The expectation may have been that nobody would bother to check on someone awaiting sentencing for child porn. They forgot to account for the closeness of some families who don’t abandon their kids even if they do awful things. "
Salling has been surrounded by his family since this first broke, I think. They were visible at his court appearances I read. Stupid for anyone to assume they wouldn't call immediately if he went missing.
An A list producer connected to Mark Salling screams Ryan Murphy to me.
ReplyDeleteI was thinking it was odd that he's=d commit suicide in a remote area, instead of his house!
ReplyDeleteNot if he wanted to be successful. He had already attempted it several times and was staying with a friend. They were keeping a pretty close eye on him because he had attempted and failed several times before. Apparently it was one of his favorite spots to go so it makes sense.
DeleteSo this is what really happened? Well, makes sense.
ReplyDeleteMark Salling
+1 Charlie Sheen
And Ryan Murphy is interesting guess, I read some rumours that he is twisted.
I knew this was no suicide as soon as I read it.
ReplyDeleteHe would have killed himself prior to this plea deal.
He knew too much, ran with too many seedy people, was involved in too much seedy shit. He had to go but these people who did this only provided themselves with a temporary solution.
This will all still come out.
He attempted suicide several times already you have no clue what you're talking about.
DeleteI'm wondering if he called family members to say goodbye or tell them something else that alarmed them. Someone saw him at 11:30pm and yet the family went to the police only a few hours later in the middle of the night to report him missing.
ReplyDeleteWell he was suicidal and they were keeping pretty close tabs on him so I'm assuming after not being able to reach him for just a few hours they freaked out knowing what his state of mind was.
DeleteIs this our commenter friend "John Doe" who has not been seen here recently? I always found his comments interesting and, in my view, substantially correct.
ReplyDeletehttps://twitter.com/JohnDoe78359022
Yeh I think so!! I follow him too, I'm always trying to find you guys on twitter and I've always thought it was the same guy.
DeleteI was wondering the same yesterday. @JohnDoe, where are you?
DeleteYikes, this seems to corroborate at least some of it: http://www.tmz.com/2018/01/30/mark-salling-dead-dies-suicide-note-body-hanging/
ReplyDelete- body found by "dumb luck"
- no note
- we know he had just signed a plea deal with sentencing on 3/7
Why are people calling out Spielberg? Any evidence? Can't imagine he's involved in this sort of stuff. Seems decent?
ReplyDelete@BeaBorges
DeleteSpielberg is a bad guess for this particular blind. However....
...around these parts, SS is considered just the opposite of decent. He's number 2 or 3 on the list of active Hollywood Pedos. Someone (maybe) can link the archived IMDB list of Hollywood pedophiles. It has been posted on here many, many times.
There are some SS defenders on the site but most of us consider them to be newbies or shills.
People love to call SS a pedo and I don't get it either. There have been zero accusations except for wold conspiracies on the internet. No one in HW besides looney ass Crispin Glover has ever even said anything of the sort about him. It seems that if you make amazing movies with child actors about childhood then you are a pedo. Never mind that none of his movies are creepy in that way but people will read something into anything. Obviously you never really know anyone but until there are accusations I'm not even buying into the Spielberg nonsense. It seems a bunch of people want him to be a pedo but so many actors who have worked with him as children seem to speak highly of him and most of them seemed to have turned out pretty well considering how fucked up Hollywood can be.
DeleteThere is no reason to call out Spielberg. He has been linked to a couple of creepy (rather than abusive) BIs here. His obsession with kids is a little weird and, like Michael Jackson, he seems childlike himself.
ReplyDeleteThat's all as far as I know.
Can't be Salling. He was found just a short ways away and in a direct line from where he parked his car. The spot he chose was a favorite of his by a creek. He previously posted a photo of the spot with him in it a few years ago on his Twitter account. If he had left a map marking the spot for investigators, it wouldn't have made discovering his body any simpler. I think the dumb luck they referred to is because of the ease with which they located him.
ReplyDeleteOK, this is weird. It's a photo of Mark Salling from 2015 standing on a rock in the creek right next to the spot where his body was found. Don't know who took the photo or how this website found it.
ReplyDeletehttps://theblast.com/mark-salling-death-photo-creek/
Those do not appear to be the same rock to me. Not even close
DeleteThanks, Austin. I guess that's where the website found it.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteSure Bia, and thank you. That's the one.
ReplyDeleteso the FBI really is ok looking like idiots, I guess.
ReplyDeletebc man oh man, Geffen is probably LAUGHING at them.
Whatever Mark knew he would of had to give up to get the plea deal. I'm just pissed none of the victims will get paid now since the Judge didn't sign off on it. They will have to sue the estate and probably won't get much.
ReplyDeleteHonestly, I don't think it was murder. He's just like any other coward that took the easy way out rather than face the consequences of his crimes.
But he already entered his plea so this makes zero sense. You normally make a deal before you enter your plea. This BI is bullshit trying to capitalize on a big story in the news right now. When you name names you do it in exchange for a lighter sentence at the time you enter your plea. He had already entered his plea but had yet to be sentenced. Too bad Enty messed that part up weird that a lawyer would fuck that up.
Deleteyou can't just imply that ryan and matthew are involved in this in some way, they are/were such great models for us fans to follow, if you do know something about them it's time you grow the hell up and start using names and telling straight away what they did, if they really did it, it's just sick to see you posting this crap and people blindly believing it and offending those the people implied on the blinds
ReplyDelete@Isa You must be new around here.
DeleteCar was found at: 34.292244,-118.286093 (parked in the Big Tujunga Canyon Road pull-off by Pipe Canyon). This is NOT a “park” park but rather it’s just past the start of some very steep, rugged, mountainous wilderness which is what the bulk of the Angeles National “Forest” is.
ReplyDeleteMark’s body was found “suicided” approximately 150’ as the crow flies, but that’s some very heavy brush running along the Big Tujunga Creek which runs along the road. If he hadn’t been reported missing, odds are his car would have simply been cited, tagged and towed eventually and given the minimal traffic on that road, that process could very easily have taken a week or weeks.
Being reported missing undoubtedly resulted in his vehicle(s)’s license plate being flagged and subsequently ANY local/county/state/federal vehicle tied into the license plate auto-reading (or manually reporting) database resulting in an alert.
Let’s hipe that list has already been given in to the authorities, or that he had sent a friend a backup copy “in the event of”. The BBC are still not reporting this as a suicide. They are saying very carefully that he “has died” and that “American media outlets are calling it an apparent suicide”.
ReplyDeleteTo whomever thinks they can easily spot a body hanging from the pull-off his vehicle was found, no chance in hell seeing more than 10’ into that thick brush. Take a look:
ReplyDeletehttps://goo.gl/maps/tJFNj3YwiJo
This BI is 100% Mark Salling and is probably the most direct and blunt BI ever. Anyone saying otherwise I would bet dollars to doughnuts is a paid shill.
If I was a person that had information on anything in Hollywood, I would make a statement saying how anti rope and belt I am and that I vow to never own either of those things again., then if something happened involving those items you’d know my death was not by my own hands. I realize this boy had done some awful things, but imagine if you was him and people intentionally came to shut you up for good. that’s really scary.
ReplyDelete@ Itttt - here's a photo showing Mark's car where he left it parked with the same blue port-a-potty as in the google URL you provided. It was a big flag that enabled investigators to locate him in no time with a bit of routine searching.
ReplyDeletehttps://pmchollywoodlife.files.wordpress.com/2018/01/mark-salling-body-found-spl-2.jpg?w=1000
Re: the trees, Mark probably wasn't hanging in the air, but rather just enough to cut off his air supply if he let his body slump - just like Aaron Hernandez did in his prison cell, or Soundgarden's Chris Cornell did in his hotel suite bathroom.
Aaron Hernandez greased the floor and Chris Cornell was whacked out of his head, if not actually murdered
DeleteDisgusting. They need to put them in protective custody if they're going to name names.
ReplyDeleteI ASSURE you my google street view link as well as the latitude/longitude coordinates I provided are to the EXACT location his vehicle was parked, which is indeed the location of the photo that Austin linked.
ReplyDeleteSee pic 16/34 or 17/35 at the dailymail photo collection:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5331317/Mark-Salling-dead-apparent-suicide.html
www.hollywoodlife.com/2018/01/30/mark-salling-body-removed-video-glee-suicide/
http://abc7.com/entertainment/glee-actor-mark-salling-found-dead-from-suicide/3007458/
Matthew Morrison Ryan Murphy protected by Geffin
ReplyDeleteLets face it, everyone with evidence is going to be fishing with Fredo soon. We should call them bobbers based on how often they die at the end of a string or in the water.
ReplyDeleteI wouldn't say that road is heavily trafficked, exactly, but it is regularly trafficked. It's one of the few ways up into the San Gabriel Mountains. Forest Service people, workers at the dam on that road. They'd notice the same car parked there day after day.
ReplyDeleteIt's also isolated enough that any foul play noises would go unnoticed, especially at night. I'm not sold on that idea, but it is at least plausible. Still don't think they'd leave the car.
I still say it’s more than plausible given the history of those SGM canyons in body disposal. There are serial killers who based their entire strategy on the certainty that they could safely dump their victims there with very little likelihood of them being found in any useful condition.
DeleteEven when the odd car or truck goes by, the area is incredibly desolate.
I don't know didn't he already have plenty of time to name names? He was charged and pleaded guilty months ago. He was going to be sentenced in about a month. He's been suicidal for a while now and is that really so hard to believe? His career was over. He would have never worked again. I'm sure he lost all his Hollywood and other friends. There was definitely no coming back from what he did. All he had to look forward to was up to 7 years in prison and paying restitution that he probably couldn't afford after never being able to find work again. Who wouldn't be suicidal? He was also on antidepressants and had attempted suicide previously. Pictures of him lately show him looking pretty raggedy. He was obviously not doing well. It would be weird for the killers to leave his car if they didn't want him to be found. I don't doubt he was possibly part of a larger pedo ring. Obviously he got the photos from someone or somewhere but I'm guessing dark web or something like that. Not sure how one finds that shit and I'm not about to research it. I don't really want to know. I'm know there are plenty of pedos in HW and it wouldn't surprise me if the names thrown around here are some of them but this guy was suicidal. I would think the FBI would be able to trace the origin of the photos without his help once they have the images. I agree the trees didn't really look like the kind of trees you could hang yourself from but its possible that it supported his weight. We don't really know that his entire body weight was hanging from the tree he could have just cut off his air supply enough to kill himself.
ReplyDeleteokay, so lets suppose this blind is real, are you guys trying to tell me that matthew and ryan are involved in a possible murder?
ReplyDeleteIn going back and looking at the photos I think they're a bit misleading. The photos on TMZ show police tape around some very small trees but it's labeled as "police tape along the trail" so it's very likely they blocked off the entire trail leading into the area where he was found to keep paparazzi and news reporters out of the area while they worked. I doubt we are seeing actual photos of the tree from which he hung himself. There are photos of trees that appear larger if you click through so I'm assuming there are larger trees along the trail that could have supported his weight. Logic says that even if the scene was staged after the fact they would have had to find a tree large enough to support the weight of his dead body without breaking for him to be found hanging the way he was. So obviously we aren't seeing the tree he was found hanging from in the photos.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteThis pedo ring is going to burst. Francis Ford Copola, Dan Schnieder, Steven Speilburg, David Geffen. Charlie Sheen. All dirty
ReplyDeleteUnknown you have no idea how happy your comments make me, finally someone with common sense and reasoning and not crazy conspiracy theories. Of course this blind is bullshit and so are most of the blinds on this site. Steven Spielberg is a decent man and brilliant filmmaker and to claim otherwise is just nuts
ReplyDeleteThanks. I'm not saying this site never gets it right, it certainly does but is this even a blind item? They might as well just say "Mark Salling was murdered and it was staged to look like a suicide". This will never be a reveal that I can guarantee because it's bullshit. Like I said if he was gonna name names he would have done that when he entered his plea in exchange for a lighter sentence and all of that would have been done at the same time. I would be much more impressed if this BI was written a week ago saying he was about to name names and they were planning on silencing him and make it look like a suicide. After the fact it's just trying to make it fit a narrative that it can easily fit in the mind of a bunch of conspiracy theorists who never want to believe people commit suicide even when they attempt it several times before they're successful.
DeleteLucy some people are easily influenced by crazy cockamamie rumors and may read an idiotic blog and try to harm someone based on pure conjecture. Like for instance when some guy burst into the DC pizza place with a gun looking to see free alleged child porn victims because a right wing website claimed there was a child porn ring operating underneath. It is all very entertaining until some loony attacks Spielberg or Schneider or someone else because a website said so
ReplyDeleteWow. Hi Dan, we are surprised you read these. You'll be soon-
Delete*tick* tock*
lol I love when people accuse other people of being someone just because they don't buy into the same conspiracies they do. Do we really think any big time producer would take the time to come here and comment? Let's say they are running a pedo ring. When would they find the time between running the pedo ring, molesting children, and producing/directing movies? It's too funny😂😂😂
DeleteI'm Steven Spielberg btw. Anyone who sends $500 to my PayPal address will get two tickets to my next movie premiere starring Tom Hanks. Movie name to be announced soon 😂😂😂
DeleteMark Sailing's very close friends, people who loved him despite his predilections for CP,
ReplyDeleteknow he did not kill himself. They likely also know who Mark would be afraid of..
they know the names. Everybody is telling everybody the names now.
As much as the Serial Killing Hollywood Pedophiles want to cover their tracks,
they fail to realize the game has changed with technology, the gig is up.
The Police/FBI cannot cover for you anymore.
You can't buy them off or compromise them and expect a guaranteed ROI.
Sure you can try, but they are no longer the gatekeepers.
Too many people have the information, the videos, the photos.
It's only a matter of time before all of those videos, photos and your names
are dropped on the WWW for all the world to see.
No matter how many more sick staged suicides you order,
it won't matter.
They know who you are.
We know who you are and everybody is tired of
your evil sick sh+t.
It's the Age of Aquarius Folks,
and these evil f+cks know you can't buy your way out of the Zodiac.
Actually all his close friends and family said he was suicidal and reported him missing right away and were worried because they knew he was suicidal. There were hospital visits and many failed suicide attempts prior to this so wtf are you talking about? His family and friends are not the least bit surprised by this nor are they questioning whether or not he killed himself because they know he did.
DeleteHH314....kinda begs the question as to why you’re here, no...?
ReplyDelete"Mark Sailing's very close friends, people who loved him despite his predilections for CP,
ReplyDeleteknow he did not kill himself. "
Yet multiple stories are out right now quoting Salling's friends and family talking about how depressed he was lately, mentioning his prior attempts to commit suicide.
+1 Unknown and HH314
Exactly people just talk outta their ass and make shit up. I have no clue where they get it. There are actual hospital records and visits of him trying to kill himself. Pretty hard to fake. People are nuts.
DeleteDid you see a large sex trafficking ring was broken up today? The day after Salling was found?
ReplyDeleteI haven't read all the comments yet but ....."they found Salling’s body on the 11900 block of Big Tujunga Road at 8:50 AM". You can google the spot on street view and case the area.
ReplyDeleteSeems very odd that they didn't get the names before they gave him a plea deal, either they are pretending he hadn't given them the names until they are ready to use them (in which case why didn't they keep him locked up or under surveillance for his own safety) or the justice system is up to the eye balls in this pedo swamp.
I'm no lawyer but the fact that he is now dead may negate the information he gave if he wasn't under oath at the time, which would put the authorities back at square one, looking for more proof or someone else to snitch (unlikely after this , unless they already have a terminal illness).
No, his death wouldn't negate the information he gave up, especially if it was backed up with a computer trail and if Salling has already given testimony, an affidavit or a deposition.
ReplyDeleteIt's a case by case thing whether the personal testimony Salling has already provided can be used in court.
+1 plot you are correct. He would have had to give the information at the time and would have received his sentence right away. You give info, plea, and know your sentence pretty quickly if it's good info which I'm assuming they would know pretty quickly. He most likely entered a plea deal
Deletebecause they had him dead to rights and to avoid an embarrassing trial. They probably told him they would give him a lighter sentence by avoiding trial and pleading. The fact that he was awaiting sentencing tells me he just entered a plea to avoid trial and not because he gave info or else he would have been sentenced much sooner.
Here's my understanding of how plea deals work. You come to an agreement that IF you provide this information, your charges will be reduced to this. You make the agreement, but THEN you have to deliver. And a list of names isn't going to cut it. That's useless in court, and the probably already know the names anyway. What you have to provide is testimony of knowledge of crimes. That happens after you've "agreed" to the plea.
ReplyDeleteThe point of the plea deal is that you have to deliver before sentencing. The prosecutor could in theory say "Nope, not enough" if you don't deliver what you promised, and the deal is void. You don't really have a lot of leverage as the defendant once the process has started, not outside of what your attorneys got down on paper.
Long story short, it's likely he hadn't delivered all the actionable testimony they needed.
Wow. Reading these comments...better than a crime novel. So interesting.
ReplyDeleteI have no clue if he killed himself or was suicided, I just can't believe the police is willing to look this stupid and/or corrupt. Something has to blow up very very soon. Just because of that.
Also, as a crime book aficionado: he might have been killed before the hanging. The hanging mirrors some other, possibly unrelated deaths in recent weeks, and could be a way of trying to connect them, to take the focus off them.
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ReplyDeleteAm I the only one who sees CDaN comments as a simple list in chronological order, with no way to display which ones are being replied to by others? To me, @Unknown's series of comments just above looks like someone engaging in a conversation with himself, occasionally giving his own comments plus-ones ("+1").
ReplyDeleteYou must be because I've never +1 my own comment. There is a slight indentation when you reply to someone else's comment. You may miss it or you may not be seeing it correctly depending on how you're viewing it.
DeleteI'm also female btw.
DeleteDoug, add ?m=1 to the end of the url to get the mobile version of the site which has threaded replies. E.g. http://www.crazydaysandnights.net/2018/01/blind-item-8_31.html?m=1
Delete@Unknown
ReplyDelete"The fact that he was awaiting sentencing tells me he just entered a plea to avoid trial and not because he gave info or else he would have been sentenced much sooner."
That sounds right. His trial was last September, he pled out in late September. He wouldn't have shared any information before then.
The guy killed himself. End of story. He didn't flip on anyone and probably didn't have the information to do that.
@ Doug, I think one comment replying to another shows up as such for those using a mobile device to access the site, but not if you're using a regular PC like I do, and apparently you too.
ReplyDelete@ Hanniam, the site where Mark was found is off by itself, but the spot must be frequented regularly because ample pull off parking has been created and a port-a-potty is stationed there.
Idk the truth, and idk what really happend( of course) and this blind does seem too much...but..just a few things
ReplyDelete1 the fact that M Selling had already tried to committ suicide doesn't mean( necessarly) that this time has been him to do it
2 He had already attempted, BUT he didn't succed..it MIGHT be that " worried" people made sure that this time he " did it"
Yet another 'suicide by hanging' (Chester, Chris, ... I cannot type a pedophile's name in the same line) - but yet more ties to Geffen, Sheen, ad nauseum (literally). When is this going to come out? When is this going to stop? Who's next? Not defending Selling and I hate that he's in any way part of a category that includes Bennington and Cornell.
ReplyDeleteNot to defend, but just thinking out loud... Any chance that Salling was set up from the beginning? Taking the rap for someone or someones? Was promised a quiet slap on the wrist in exchange but got an all out media blitz, ruined career, and actual jail time? They've already cut and run and left him hanging (sadly, literally).
ReplyDeleteAccording to the Daily Mail, the autopsy failed to confirm suicide and said that Salling's body was found in the riverbed, not hanging from a tree.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5339951/Mark-Salling-coroners-report-confirms-actor-died-Tuesday.html
Thanks for the continued (paid shill) comments, “unknown” and “HH314” however I am certain I speak for the board when I say you both protest a tad much. In the future please try not to make it so obvious where your bought and paid for allegiances lie. The tag teaming “so glad someone else feels the same” “why thank you I agree” is always a dead giveaway.
ReplyDelete@John Morlar, thanks! That works on my desktop computer.
ReplyDeleteOh FFS. Count me as a bought and paid for shill, then, because I don't believe this blind either. If Salling made a plea deal, the court has the names he named already. Killing him right before sentencing makes zero logical sense. This is made up.
ReplyDeleteEnty, seriously, is this how you want to run your blog? It used to be great before you got into the ridiculous conspiracy theories and attracted these loonball commenters.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5339951/Mark-Salling-coroners-report-confirms-actor-died-Tuesday.html
ReplyDeleteHas anyone seen this yet this morning? Not as tidy as it seems.
*WARNING*
ReplyDeleteThere is some sick shit in that article Unknown linked to. When pedos have manuals, the acts are coming sooner or later.
Oh, can a be a paid shill too? Pretty please?
@Krab
It looks like enty is trying to hold on to the conspiracy folks that flocked here after the articles about enty this fall.
On the other hand, they were all here during the election season, too, which is when I vacated for a while...for the third time. The nutters have been taking over boards all over.
There are two of us posting as unknown. I am the reasonable one who doesn't buy any of this horseshit. I didn't post the article above. I will be changing my name soon.
DeleteSalling, obviously.
ReplyDeleteCharlie Sheen most likely, Matthew Morrison runner up [Was MM ever A+?]
Ryan Murphy
David Geffen
For those who question Spielberg, search for Crispin Glover's essay on Spielberg and Adam Parfrey's film criticism on Spielberg's work up through "Hook." Read a bit about how he "discovered" Heather O'Rourke, then read the blinds posted here called "Molested to Death" and "Long Time Coming."
The increasing number of shills, frauds, liars and maybe even programmed AI bots is very telling. The heat is rising, along with the panic, around Hollywood's pedophile ring. Let's hope the nay-saying voices here are only propagandists and not actively involved.
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ReplyDeleteCOME ON, ENTY!
ReplyDeleteYou're seriously going to lose your smarter readers by feeding more garbage, like this blind, to your more gullible readers, you know, your “Kool-Aid drinkers.” (Anyone who's not familiar with this term, look up Jim Jones and his cult following.)
Yes, some of your blinds have a great deal of truth to them, but baiting your ignorant followers with a blind like this really discredits you to the rest of us.
As unpopular as this may be, I agree 100% with the comments posted by:
@PLOT
@UNKNOWN
@KRAB
And NO, I do not know them and have never noticed their comments until this post.
Come on, fellow readers! Please step back and look at some of these blinds as they are truly written. With a little word-smithing and some higher-level thinking you too will see the light.
It’s one thing to disagree (plot, krab, and a couple others)...it’s a whole other thing to make comment after comment after comment ad naseum a la unknown attempting to derail and deflect (coupled with the sidekick HH314’s comments). Look at the blogger responses ordered by time and you will see literally 20 posts in a row by unknown. Again, “methinks unknown doth protest much”. The blind gets posted, and people submit and discuss their answers/theories, conspiratorial or otherwise. Period.
ReplyDeleteAnd certainly not saying unknown is one of the actual perps, just a dumb dildo of a shill, paid or otherwise. Funny how mere mention of SS or DG (and a couple others...and ONLY those few) in a BI’s discussion thread brings these trolls out of the woodwork.
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Delete
DeleteYou're a fucking idiot. I actually believe Geffen and Schneider could be pedos but have yet to see any reason as to why Spielberg is always a guess. Geffen and Schneider at least have reputations that portray them as huge assholes that could do some fucked up shit.
"a dumb dildo of a shill, paid "
ReplyDeleteOh lemme be a dumb dildo of a paid shill, pleeeease! It would be so easy.
DDonna deleted this comment, some of which I'll copy -
ReplyDelete"Crispin Glover's essay"
Read it. As an alternative narrative to Hollywood, it's pretty interesting. On the other hand it reads like some Charlie Manson nuttery of the most damaged sort.
It also refuses to address the problem on the very surface of the Hollywood product - the hypersexualization of children, from commercials to big film, and the silencing of women through enforced stereotypes that make the Head Honchos feel safe. THAT is the problem here and why we have so much hysteria about both at the moment.
The only way to combat this is to quit fucking watching shows that market in coy little kids posing like sex workers - the early years - and programs that lock women into the blanket conformity - the sexy ones or the bitchy ones, ONLY.
Crispin Glover is a fucking whack job. Did you ever see him on Letterman? He showed up on acid if I remember correctly. That sounds like someone who has their shit together 😒 He was always pissed at SS over a salary dispute over BTF and could never get over it so he lost his mind and started going off about him. He thought he was the star and he was wrong.
Delete@LTTTT
ReplyDeleteIRONIC! You did exactly what you “accused” @unknown of doing. Quoting you:
“… Look at the blogger responses ordered by time and you will see literally 20 posts in a row by unknown. …”
The above comment you posted was immediately posted within 4 minutes of your previous comment you left at 10:56AM. Oh, did you have a change of thought or something to add to that post? Did you ever think (come on, higher-level thinking here now) that @unknown was posting new comments as thoughts came to her? Also, please note the time of night it was when @unknown was posting comments. Were you up at those same times (PST) to post your accusations against her during that time?
I see you thinking so one-dimensionally with your comments because you clearly did not look at other factors. The one-dimensional thinkers are the Kool-Aid drinkers. Jim Jones would have been thrilled to have you as a follower.
Oh, one more thing… your “dumb dildo of a shill” insult does not reflect well for your intelligence either.
Like I wrote...."the panic is rising" among the pedophile crew an their enablers, supporters, shills and partners in despicable crimes.
ReplyDeleteWere it only so that I had the ability to erase such comments! Another sign of the escalating panic, the false accusations, since yesterday's personal attacks only made me laugh.
Since we're talking about Spielberg now, once you've read the Crispin Glover and Adam Parfrey essays, here's more food for thought:
Remember when SS and GL were considering having Indiana Jones be a child rapist of Marion when she was only 12? And how it would be okay because she would have been coming on to him? They thought this was really "interesting." Even now, in the final version of "Raiders," Marion yells at him that she "was a child!"
http://www.bizpacreview.com/2017/11/04/stop-youre-read-lucas-spielberg-discuss-indiana-jones-sleeping-11-year-old-557532
Here Spielberg seems to get a callout as a casting couch kind of guy:
https://youtu.be/mfD1ct5FvXk?t=1m59s
There are other examples and speculation on fringier sites that I will not share here.
Why no DGA nomination for "The Post"? Why no SAG nominations for any of the cast? Why was it shut out at the Golden Globes? Why no Oscar nomination for Best Director?
The desperation and panic are rising. You can smell it, a mix of flop sweat and soiled garments.
So nervous😂😂😂. So is SS a casting couch guy or a pedo? They are very different things.
DeleteOkay so obviously there are two of us that are posting under the name Unknown. When I figure out how I will be changing my name. I am the skeptic and did not post the daily mail link above. If I'm a paid shill can you please tell me where to collect my check? Never mind, I already told you I'm Steven Spielberg and someone else on here is Dan Schneider so we obviously don't need the money. I guess using common sense and deductive reasoning means you must be either a paid shill or one of the supposed pedos. If you don't go along with the crowd and buy everything hook, line, and sinker watch out!
ReplyDelete"Remember when SS and GL were considering having Indiana Jones be a child rapist of Marion when she was only 12?"
ReplyDeleteDefinitive proof! Throw them in jail immediately!
SS insistence on a back story of abuse or neglect in his child characters is well known. On the other hand, SS has simplistic and repetitive characterizations in every fucking one of his movies, no matter what the role they all boil down to the stereotypes that SS finds easy to understand. He's the purveyor of the After School Special writ way too large.
"Why no DGA nomination for "The Post"?"
Cuz Hollywood is sick of Spielberg's facile rewrites of history, especially history that many in Hollywood remember or have read about extensively? Wanna know how many former journalists exist in the Hollywood scene?
"The desperation and panic are rising. You can smell it, a mix of flop sweat and soiled garments."
Sure. And you imagine you are part of it, being here, bringing that hackneyed description to life! Bully for you.
"He showed up on acid if I remember correctly."
ReplyDeleteYes he did. If you read the nuts who think Glover has written a brilliant manifesto, they assert that Glover was secretly drugged for his Letterman fiasco.
I shit you not.
Lol 😂😂😂
DeleteAlso, it's pretty obvious that one Unknown is posting via nested comments--that is, in response to other people's comments. If you don't have nested comments in your browser or however you're reading this, it looks like 8 posts in a row.
ReplyDeleteDdonna Ttarty you're just not very bright. Period. Go back to Reddit or 4Chan or wherever you came from. The "everyone who disagrees is a pedo or paid shill or paid shill pedo" shit is really batshit loonball.
Enty, blinds like this really suck. Hell, I'll even accept Teen Mom blinds over these. Or Kardashians even during KFF. (Newbies, look it up)
So I changed my name. I'm the paid shill dildo Unknown or whatever I was called. The other Unknown is the one who posted the Daily mail link.
DeleteYes, @KRAB.
ReplyDeleteI agree that the Teen Mom blinds are actually more believable than this blind.
That's not saying much either because if you follow the Twitter rant between all the parties that Enty used for his sources, you'll see that blind was totally made up.
Enty knew it was BS because he quickly pointed the finger at this sources for that blind to get the heat off of him after the Twitter war between all participants erupted and the truth came out.
I was actually hopeful that Enty might pull a white rabbit out of his hat within a day or two after the Twitter war and show the goods to back up the blind he had written as fact.
SMH, Enty. Keep it more real, at least for those readers who can clearly read between your lines.
If I saw you pull the white rabbit out of your hat more often, I would spend a lot of time clicking on all the ads on our site.
I must have missed that one.
DeleteThe thing I find so weird is that people never want to believe that someone would commit suicide. Especially when that someone has a history of suicide attempts and depression. Chris Cornell spoke of his depression, problems with addiction, and thoughts of suicide constantly then he commits suicide and people would rather believe he was murdered in some strange pedo ring plot. Same with Chester Bennington history of drug use, suicidal thoughts, and depression. Mark Salling had no reason to live and every reason to want to die, attempted suicide multiple times, finally succeeded and no one wants to believe he killed himself. Is it really easier to believe that these people were all killed and it was staged to look like suicide? Yet all of them had previously had very open battles with depression and suicidal actions/thoughts? That is some crazy plot! People always try to claim that Cornell was better or Bennington was better but what people seem not to understand is there is no "getting better" from depression there is no "cure" for mental illness there is only treatment and management and often times it is a terminal illness.
DeleteA little background on me my sister suffered from mental illness. She self medicated with drugs and became addicted. We tried the best we could but she never got treatment. We just lost her to a drug overdose a little over a month ago. Like I said, terminal illness often ends with death. Mental illness is an ugly thing and for those who have never dealt with it you don't understand. I've had doctors tell me they would rather have cancer than a mental illness because at least with cancer there is hope for a cure.
Thirteen days after I lost my sister a very dear family friend who was like a brother to me killed himself. His daughter is like my niece and grew up in my home. He took his gun went out to the beach and shot himself. He did not leave a note. It was devastating. As far as most people could tell there were no signs. He was drinking a lot and had been sick with the flu but other than that no major signs. No he wasn't killed by a pedo ring. He didn't have the easiest life growing up but he had a job, friends, a gf, and a daughter. He even called to offer condolences the day of my sister's memorial and he seemed fine. He killed himself 3 days later. No note, a lot of people don't leave notes, especially men. So stop with all your bullshit conspiracies. You don't know. We think we know the people around us but you never know the torture and depression people hide. The three people everyone keeps claiming were murdered very publicly struggled with depression. Maybe Chris Cornell's wife is a cold hearted bitch who is an opportunist but he killed himself. Maybe David Geffen is a pedo but Cornell very openly struggled with depression his whole life.
I had to listen to my niece cry about why her Dad would kill himself, leave her in this world, and never want to see her again. It tore my heart out because I knew when he took his life that's not what he was thinking. People who suffer depression don't think that way. They think they are ending their suffering and the suffering of others who have to deal with their depression. I think Mark Salling clearly had his own demons and I can't say I mourn the death of a pedo but constantly calling suicide murder in these crazy conspiracies is fucking looney and disrespectful. When it comes to Bennington and Cornell I certainly take offense to that. I speak from personal experience when I say it's not helpful and it's fucked up. It takes a lot for family and friends to come to terms when your loved one dies in this manner. It's pretty shitty when people claim drug overdoses and suicide are murders when you know they're not.
I've known more than one person in my life who has committed suicide and only about 20% of them left notes. The fact that there wasn't a note means nothing. Be more respectful people these people do have people who loved them.
A history of depression was not the only thing that would have driven Mark Salling to suicide.
ReplyDeleteI’m sure his attorney warned him of what he was in for once he got to prison. With his celebrity notoriety and being a convicted pedophile, all of the prisoners were waiting for him.
THE “HELL” THAT WAS READY TO WELCOME SALLING WHEN HE GOT TO PRISON WAS MORE THAN ENOUGH TO HIGHLY MOTIVATE HIM TO AVOID PRISON AT ALL COSTS – INCLUDING THE COST OF HIS LIFE.
Then having to be a registered sex offender after prison is a life sentence worse than being in prison.
Exactly
Delete@Original unknown skeptic:
ReplyDelete"So nervous😂😂😂. So is SS a casting couch guy or a pedo? They are very different things."
BOTH. That's just how evil he is. Now for evidence let's talk about the character of Marion in Raiders. Her saying she was a child to Indy means just exactly that, she was an underage child at the time, not an overwrought way of saying she was so young back then. Check and MATE, Mr. Spielberg. (Also you're Jewish and yes I threw that in there for laughs. Where do these loonballs come from?)
OK, so now can I have my money, Dreamworks? Thanks ever so.
Update: Mark's death was officially ruled a suicide today
ReplyDeletehttp://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5339951/Mark-Salling-coroners-report-confirms-actor-died-Tuesday.html
The nutters are just gonna say that the coroner covered this up and got paid off to call this a suicide.
DeleteI wish we could "like" comments.
ReplyDelete@ Original Unknown skeptic
ReplyDeleteThank-you so much for taking the time to write that out...so beautifully, too.
I hope people read it. I hope they get your point.
May you find peace with the decisions made by your sister and your friend. May you offer a glimmer of hope to your niece as well.
Thank you. I still cry every day over my sister and I don't know if I'll ever really "get over it" but life does goes on. She left children behind which is heartbreaking but also comforting. Because of the things I've dealt with in my life with my sister and other issues I've tried hard to understand addiction, depression, and mental illness. I get really frustrated when I hear people talk about it without any understanding. I've also studied it as part of my degree. People's misunderstanding of mental health and issues surrounding it are part of the problem. It maintains the stigma and prevents people from getting help so I do take it more personally than most. Especially lately since it's so fresh for me. Labeling every suicide a staged murder doesn't help. If you believed everything on the internet then you would think no one has ever committed suicide. It's absurd.
DeleteIf you want to die, I don't believe that you suicide in a public place. The people who check into a hotel and overdose well in advance of check-out time actually want to die. A body hanging in a public park looks like a message. This isn't tinfoil hat thinking, it's logic.
ReplyDeleteIt's wasn't a public place it was a remote area of Big Tujunga Canyon in a riverbed area. That is literally how it was described, as a remote area. You obviously are not from L.A. and do not know the area. It is not very public and does not have high traffic. He could have gone undiscovered for days or weeks if his car wasn't parked there.
DeleteOh please, "if you want to die, I don't believe that you suicide in a public place." What planet do you people come from? People jump off tall buildings, people jump off high bridges, or then there's my best friend who jumped in front of a train at a public train station.
ReplyDeleteExactly and I also mentioned my friend who just shot himself in public on one of the most famous beaches in L.A.. I'm assuming so someone other than his girlfriend would find him and to spare her having to live with that image and in the home where he killed himself or having to move. The cleanup from that kind of thing isn't exactly easy or pretty. There's also Japan's famous suicide forest, which again is pretty damn public. The Golden Gate Bridge and pretty much any other bridge that's high enough for people to die if they jump from. But again this wasn't a place that was all that "public", it was pretty remote for L.A.. It was public in the sense that it was not privately owned but not heavily trafficked.
Delete