And You Thought Woody Allen Was Bad
So, I have had this story for about a year. I got it at the same time as what turned out to be Timmy/Shimmy. I can tell you that the person who gave me all my great classic Hollywood stories passed away within the last year, but he did manage to pass along a few more before he passed. A great man who will be missed a bunch, but his stories live on.
For this one, we need to start way back. Even really before classic Hollywood. Hell when this started there really wasn't a Hollywood yet. This is about an A list actress for almost all of her career. Acting was what she was most famous for, but she was probably better at other things. Academy Award winner? Nope. She was in a nominated film or two though.
When our actress was still a very young teenager, she got pregnant by a man. Some say that the father of the baby was a man she later married, while others think she may have got pregnant by a relative. In any event, the fact is that the person who impregnated her was unable or unwilling to marry her at that time. She gave birth to a boy and gave the boy up for adoption.
The years pass and our actress grows into a fine woman, and starts to make a name for herself. Finally she ends up in Hollywood. It isn't where she was planning on going necessarily, but when she finally made it there, she made it really, really big.
Now, although there wasn't really open adoption back when she gave up her child, there was what was called family adoption. In this case, our actress who had a cousin who was of suitable age to have children, already had one or two of her own with her husband so took the infant in, and raised it as their own. This was not a particularly close cousin. Maybe a 2nd or so, but even 2nd cousins want their share of fame by being close to a famous relative and so the whole family always wanted a piece of our actress. At some point, the son of our actress came out to Hollywood. He didn't know he was her son. All he knew was that he had a cousin or an aunt or someone who he saw in the movie theatre each week and thought maybe she could give him a job.
Well he was a good looking guy and our actress said she could probably help him out when he showed up out of the blue one day and landed on her doorstep. At the time he showed up, she was in between marriages. Kind of. When he explained who he was, she knew it was her son. The thing is, she decided not to inform him of this face and apparently the three or four people who also knew, chose to not inform him either.
Our actress always had men with her. Always helping her out or running errands. She was never without some kind of company for flirtation. Well one day, apparently things got a little carried away in the flirtation department and our actress and her son ended up rolling around in the sack. It was the first time, but not the last. It went on for about six months. Not everyday, but a few times a week.
She never told him how she was related to him. What she did though was at some point get a conscience or got guilt and she set him up with some extra from some film she was working and she was one hell of a matchmaker because the couple fell in love and moved back to where our actress was from. It is somewhere in that time frame, that her son either told someone in his family, OR, he told the extra he married and she passed it along to someone in the family. Apparently only one person in the family found out. That person confronted the actress who admitted it, but begged that it be kept quiet. No one would have printed anything anyway, but she still wanted it kept quiet. On the home front it was kept quiet. But, over the years, as our actress aged, she would be telling stories of men she had been with and every once in awhile would let it slip out that she had a very illicit affair. There are probably a handful of people she told the story to, and one of them was the man who told it to me.
O.M.G.!!!
ReplyDeleteICK!
ICK!
ICK!
no idea, but I'm seriously grossed out!
First, let me say GROSS. How about Katherine Hepburn (just a wild guess) and the person who told you would be Paul Newman?
ReplyDeletehepburn won oscars. i think three of them.
ReplyDeletei'm fiing this one under b.s. with the timmy/shimmy story. sorry enty.
Wow. Sick as hell. But wow.
ReplyDeleteHelen Mirren? eh, she's a Brit, though. But she's awesome.
ReplyDeleteJust a wild guess.
I'm with the ews & icks on this one.
ReplyDeleteAnd I will toss in blech & how awful if someone figures this out, & the son & his wife find out.
How about Mary Pickford or Gloria Swanson?
ReplyDeletehello people old hollywood!!!!
ReplyDeleteGloria Swanson was born in 1899...died in 83...was A list but never won and Oscar, nominated 3 times though
what about marylin monroe?
ReplyDeletei'm not guessing, but it sounds like enty says she never won an oscar but was in a couple of films that were nominated. he doesn't say she was nominated.
ReplyDelete. Academy Award winner? Nope. She was in a nominated film or two though.
Mae West
ReplyDeleteHOLY SHIT. I knew where this story was going once the son went to Hollywood, lol.
ReplyDeleteThat must have been one horny broad.
mary pickford, lillian gish, and gloria swanson all come to mind. I think pickford is most likely.
ReplyDeleteGloria Swanson is a really good guess. She was married 6 times...had lots of lovers, started way before talkies (before classic Hollywood). Ent doesn't say the actress was never nominated.
ReplyDeletelolol.
ReplyDeletethats amazingly sick yet amusing.
I think it may be a Hitchcock chick, so,
Kim Novak? Vera Miles?
if not i'm going for Marilyn Monroe or Myrna Loy.
What about Betty Grable?
ReplyDeleteA List - an actress, but better at dancing.
Never won nor was nominated for an Oscar.
At least two of her movies were nominated for an Oscar.
Let's not forget:
ReplyDeleteHell when this started there really wasn't a Hollywood yet.
Means this goes back way before Hitchcock.
This is about an A list actress for almost all of her career. Acting was what she was most famous for, but she was probably better at other things.
So let's figure out what those other things could be.
"When there really wasn't a hollywood yet" would indicate someone from the silents or early talkie days. You have to go back very far for that. No one from the 20s, 40s, 50s, or 60s.
ReplyDeleteGloria Swanson is a good guess. It's rumored her son Joseph was fathered by Joseph Kennedy. I've never heard anything about an early adopted son or this other sexual shanannagins, though. She was nominated but never won.
Mary Pickford won an Oscar, so it can't be her.
Lillian Gish was prudish unto frigidity. I don't think it's her, either.
I meant 30s.
ReplyDeleteOther candidates:
Barbara Stanwyck (adopted a son)
Clara Bow (notoriously unstable)
I'll second Mae West.
ReplyDeleteStarted in Vaudville, moved to Broadway and wrote/starred in an infamous play and then went to Hollywood.
Academy Nominated film for Best Picture was She Done Him Wrong in 1933.
She was a bigamist. Married hubby #1 in 1911 divorced in 1940's. Married #2 in 1914 divorced in 1920.
Very well known to have good looking guys around.
Yuck, yuck, yuck!
ReplyDeleteThis might sound nuts but my guess is Rosemary Clooney and George Clooney based on the following:
Rosemary was an actress but also known for her singing. People could say she was a better singer than she was an actress. Don't think she ever won an Academy Award but she was arguably A list. She and George were both raised in Kentucky. Her father was a bad alcoholic. Like the actress in the blind, she's had several marriages. At some point, George ended up on her doorstep looking for help getting into acting. She also had mental problems and drug problems which might explain her willingness to do the nasty with her own kid. Clooney also is a "good looking guy" as described in the item.
Now I need to figure out if Clooney's ex-wife (not a very well known actress) was ever an extra in a Rosemary Clooney movie. And if they ever moved back to Kentucky after getting married.
Clara Bow is an interesting guess. I went digging around to make sure it wasn't Louise Brooks, but doesn't seem like her films were nominated ("Pandora's Box" was notoriously shut out).
ReplyDeleteShame on the person who said Myrna Loy. She's my hero!
I like the Mae West guess. She was a vaudevillean before she got to Hollywood (already in her late 30s), which goes along with the hints that she has other talents (singing and dancing, but she also wrote), and that she was already a grown up woman by the time she got out to Hollywood. Gloria Swanson was much younger when she started making films.
ReplyDeleteAlso, Enty says "kind of" when he refers to this actress' divorces, and Mae West's wiki entry shows that her marriages and divorces were kind of messy. Would put this affair between her two official divorce dates, 1920 (from her 2nd husband) and 1943 (from her first husband--so confusing).
Lastly, also from the wiki: "West continued to surround herself with virile men for the rest of her life, employing companions, bodyguards, and chauffeurs."
Clara Bow and Gloria Swanson are both great guesses.
ReplyDeleteLillian Gish never married, so not her. I thought Mary Pickford, because she started in films at 17 in New York, before moving to LA in 1910. Right timeframe, 3 husbands, could easily have had a baby before starting in films. Apart from the Oscar, she fits well.
ReplyDeleteI'm guessing the son and his wife are both dead, otherwise this story wouldn't be coming out.
i think the person giving the information to Ent is Jack Valenti.
ReplyDeleteHe died in 2007
not that it really has anything to do with the story.
My first thought was Mabel Normand, but I think she died too young.
ReplyDeleteGeorge Clooney is Rosemary Clooney's nephew, not son. His ex-wife's name was Talia Balsam, and she is currently Mrs. Sterling on Mad Men. And neither one is old enough Hollywood for this blind.
ReplyDeleteThis blind promises to be a great show. I'm popping the popcorn and getting a front seat!
ReplyDeleteMy early money is on Gloria Swanson. She had a dip in her career, but made a great comeback. (Enty says the actress was "A list for almost all of her career.")
And I understand she was quite a maneater.
His ex-wife's name was Talia Balsam, and she is currently Mrs. Sterling on Mad Men.
ReplyDeletenoooooo shit??? impertient vixen, i had no clue. so glad you posted that.
Is the informer who died this year Ollie Johnston? The last of Walt Disney's legendary group of animators called the "Nine Old Men," died 14 April 2008 in Sequim, Washington. He was 95.
ReplyDeleteClaire Trevor won an Oscar in 1948.
Beulah Bondi never married.
Lilian Gish never married.
Billie Burke grew up in London.
Swanson was nominated three times and had six husbands. She adopted a son in 1923.
Marlene Dietrich may be too old for this blind, as she was born in 1901 and was raised in Germany. Sounds like actress in this blind was American, because the son came to Hollywood.
Interestingly, Irene Dunne would have been 14 years old in 1912, which would have been the very early pre-Hollywood years.
Holy cow! Well, you did tell us it would be juicy. Holy cow!
ReplyDeleteNow THIS is the juicy, old-time Hollyweird gossip we love you for, Enty!
ReplyDeleteMy very first taste of CDAN was the the long blind about the old star who took too much Viagra and ran Ent around on an all-night booze run (which we guessed was Connery).
No guess yet until I check iMdb about who won Oscars vs. only being nominated.
I think the informant was johnny grant-
ReplyDeleteThought so during Timmy/Shimmy run as well. Known for his stories/proximity to stories and info...
How about Ginger Rogers? Better at dancing than acting. I haven't looked into her past re: marriages, Oscar nominated films, etc.
ReplyDeleteMy first thought was Clara Bow though.
Swanson and Dietrich came to my mind instantly, mostly because of their reputations and the fact that both were essentially A-list for most of their career(s).
ReplyDeleteI also thought of Garbo, but she apparently never married.
It feels wrong to be throwing names around on this one, lol. It's beyond unsettling.
Okay, forget Ginger Rogers, she is an Academy Award winner.
ReplyDeleteMae West
ReplyDeleteMy first thought was Jean Harlow, but she died too young. I'll have to go along with Gloria Swanson.
ReplyDeleteSwanson gave an interesting interview to Louella Parsons
ReplyDeletein 1922 (http://www.public.asu.edu/~bruce/Taylor63.txt).
After being interviewed about her travels, career, and baby daughter, she said, "I have the two big things, my work and
my child--that is all any one can ask for. We all have our disappointments, and mine are no more bitter than other peoples, only things do not always turn out as one expects."
Louella Parsons: "But you have been very lucky?"
"In some ways," she answered.
sick!
ReplyDeletei'm thinking the person who told Enty this was the guy who did Hollywood Walk of Fame..Mayor of Hollywood and died this year.
Johnny Grant
I wonder who the son is/was and whether he was famous.
ReplyDeleteI'm off the Swanson wagon -- she came to Hollywood at 16 with her first husband.
ReplyDeleteThis does not jive with ENT's "The years pass and our actress grows into a fine woman, and starts to make a name for herself. Finally she ends up in Hollywood."
my guess is mae west.
ReplyDeletei dont think it's marilyn monroe. she didnt exactly die aging and senile.
His ex-wife's name was Talia Balsam, and she is currently Mrs. Sterling on Mad Men. Who is played by John Slattery and is married to Talia in real life George looks EXACTLY like his father.
ReplyDeleteI am going with Gloria Swanson too. Lillian Gish was probably a lesbian who rarely if ever acted on her impulses.
Talk about zero self control, it must have flipped the family out, because while the son was oblivious she and the family were not. I am guessing a great deal of money passed hands after that came out.
I have a guess. It's probably wrong but for some reason it popped into my head when I read "made a name for herself"
ReplyDeleteGypsy Rose Lee
Started in vaudeville. wikipedia goes into detail about her personal life. Worked in some films. Sordid marriages. Connected to Mike Todd and Otto Preminger.
I too think Johnny Grant is the informant. Perfect.
ReplyDeleteWhat does Enty mean when he says "at the time he showed up, she was between marraiges, sort of"...must mean she was separated but not divorced?
ReplyDeleteJoan Crawford?
ReplyDeleteGene Tierney (eeew! I hope not)?
Fay Wray!
Elizabeth Taylor? I guess that wouldn't fit though, isn't she concidered a child star?? So Judy Garland would also be out.
Eva Gardner?
Betty Davis?
I don't know...just nameing uber A-Listers right now.
brenda22 - You may have hit on something.
ReplyDelete"Sort of" points to the Mae West guesses. She was married to one guy for a long time while no one knew - she even married and divorced another guy at the same time.
I am jumping on the Mae West bandwagon.
My very first taste of CDAN was the the long blind about the old star who took too much Viagra and ran Ent around on an all-night booze run (which we guessed was Connery).
ReplyDeleteConnery what?? I thought I read all the past blinds in the archives. I missed that one.
Sorry, I didn't mean to go off course. I'll look it up. Keep at it guys, this is interesting. ;)
ReplyDeleteDont believe is Gloria Swanson.She had a resolute strong personality. The kind of person capable of this is pathetic, needy of attention,with deep emotional problems.
ReplyDeleteBesides i think the key is :"The years pass and our actress grows into a fine woman, and starts to make a name for herself..."
Probably she was someone that worked on Broadway or New York movies and came Hollywood.I guess is one of those actresses who worked vaudeville and had a pretty rough early days, like Clara Bow ( who i dont believe would be capable, she was too sweet) or the Talmadge sisters ( who had a all mighty mother that wouldnt let this happen..)
Here is a good site if you are not familiar with Silent movies stars :http://www.goldensilents.com/female.html
I think Mae Murray is more likely, she was there before Hollywood, started on Broadway, married a few times and made all sorts of mistakes in her life.She was really big that days and had a pretty decadent life style
It's Mae West. The clue is "our actress grows into a fine woman". That's a line from SHE DONE HIM WRONG--Mae is called "a fine woman" and answers "Finest woman that ever walked the streets!"
ReplyDeleteOh, melissa--that Blind was posted last year, maybe over a year ago.
ReplyDeleteIt was a long one about an older star Ent was repping on some legal thing who called Ent up in the middle of the night having taken too many Viagra thinking the first ones he took weren't "taking," and had a raging boner on his hands.
I swear I thought it was Sean Connery--but I wasn't posting or guessing at that early stage so I could be wrong.
Anyone remember that one? Am I off-base?
Also, Mae West is sounding a likely fit. I had thought Liz Taylor or someone else who started young like Patti Duke, but then the "before Hollywood" tossed those guesses out.
Nice one Myrlin!
ReplyDeleteMae West was a shameless hussy, according to Wikipedia.
ReplyDeleteIF it's her, the blind does indicate that she knew this person to be her son and had relations with him anyway.
It does take a certain kind of person to do this.
Hmm.....
I like the Mae West guess.
ReplyDeletewhat is timmy/shimmy? when did ent write this one
ReplyDeleteTallulah Bankhead
ReplyDeleteI think it's Hedy Lamarr.
ReplyDeleteWow, I'm impressed Myrlin...along with the fact that she was separated for 30 or so years but not divorced...it seems like she's the best fit.
ReplyDeleteLauren Bacall
ReplyDeleteI read Bankhead was a total freak.
ReplyDeleteIts totally Tallulah. Not only would she do something like that, but she would have actually admitted it!
ReplyDeleteI think I tasted a little vomit in the back of my throat reading this. EWWW!
ReplyDeleteI'm totally clueless.
Ha, after reading this today:
ReplyDelete“Tom Cruise is a maniac. I can’t understand the way he conducts his life,” Bacall added.
I doubt it's Lauren. :)
Mae West started out her career in New York, which was the main home to the film industry before it moved to Hollywood. This could give new meaning to "moved to Hollywood before it became Hollywood".
ReplyDeleteI really like this guess.
Wild guess: Ava Gardner.
ReplyDeleteNominated for an Oscar, but never won.
Always had men around her.
From a big family that resided in a small, rural area (i.e. more likely to keep in touch with extended family from back home.)
Went to Hollywood in her late-teen years.
Never had children...
Ok, let's see if this posts...I have two thoughts.
ReplyDeleteFirst Tallalah Bankhead, she was married once, but also had long term affairs with both Hattie McDaniels and Billie Holiday which could explain the 'between marriages, sort of' comment.
The second kind of kills me, but Jessica Tandy. Not from Hollywood, was married twice, but found her way to Hollywood via the stage both in UK and NY, but after she had been tossed aside for the like of Vivian Leigh on the screen for roles she had created on the stage. That one would kill me.
Not sure if in terms of Jessica the surrounded by men comment works, but it does for Tallalah
How about....
ReplyDeleteALICE BRADY?
I'm sorry. I had to do it. I cant believe no one else guessed this by now!
:)
Oh wait! Jessica Tandy won an Oscar! Oh thank God, I didn't want that to be right.
ReplyDeleteI completely redact Jessica. Happily.
Wow! This is beyond sickening...but quite entertaining none the less. Been lurking for awhile but had to come out for this one. I'm gonna go with the majority and say Mae West. She had a long gap in between her divorces and Myrlin hit it on the head with the movie quote.
ReplyDeleteAva Gardner was my absolute first thought. But then I rejected her because of something.......ah, I remember. It's the part about the babydaddy possibly being someone she later married. Ava was married to Mickey Rooney, famous bandleader Artie Shaw, and Frank Sinatra. The blind makes it sound like the guy who got her pregnant was either family, or a nobody. Although it doesn't say that the rumor that she later married the babydaddy was true, either. So I'm stumped.
ReplyDeleteeeewwww
ReplyDeletere Mae West - I can't find that she was in any Oscar-nominated movies, which would eliminate her. I'm going back to see if any of her films were nommed for Costume or something dumb like that.
ReplyDelete"She Done Him Wrong," nominated for Best Picture.
ReplyDeleteAlso, "Every Day's a Holiday" was nominated for Best Art Direction.
ReplyDeleteI thought someone up earlier had one movie that she was in that was nominated for an oscar? I might be going senile myself though.
ReplyDeleteOh - I'm talking about Mae West. I like that guess too, but sometimes the "obvious" ones (if this is obvious) aren't it.
I'm going to rule out Clara Bow. She wasn't as wild as her reputation makes her out to be. I'm liking the Mae West guess. In other wild Mae West gossip, there is a rumor that she died in the 50's and a male relative impersonated her until he died which would explain the campy, draggy personae of her later years.
ReplyDeleteI wouldn't be shocked if it was Gloria Swanson though.
okay, I guess Mae West is still in the running. The blind says she appeared in a "nominated film or two."
ReplyDeleteThese are the films she was in that were nominated for an Oscar, neither won -
She Done Him Wrong - Outstanding Production, 1932
Every Day's a Holiday - Art Direction, 1937
So by the language of the blind, I guess those two films count. I sort of call bullshit on that, since, um, Art Direction??
and by the way, I know I'm a freak for looking it up, but oscars.org has a great search engine. But I might still be a freak. I can't believe I looked them up.
Yes, you're a freak, but so are the rest of us here, so you're in good company.
ReplyDeleteCan we have a Mae West quote-off, regardless of whether or not it's her?
ReplyDeleteI'm going to start with one truly appropriate for CDAN:
"A man can be short and dumpy and getting bald but if he has fire, women will like him."
I guess it's Oklahoma City's own Kay Francis. Four of her films received AA nominations although none for BEST PICTURE...and One Way Passage won the AA for best screenplay.
ReplyDeleteCrazy life in New York City, may even have been a prostitute. Started making Paramount movies in NYC before coming out to Hollywood.
Birthdate probably 1905. Five husbands, but single from 1933-39.
What about Rita Hayworth? She was a dancer in vaudeville first, from Brooklyn, changed her name after signing with Columbia Pictures and only played bit parts before hitting it big in movie with Cary Grant. All the studios were on her then. Married 5 times and the dates are really close together. Even some where she was married and divorced in the same year. Died of Alzheimer's so she could have prattled on about her life, especially early life (Alzheimer patients lose their short term memory first...can't tell ya what happened ten mins ago but can tell ya in detail about childhood).
ReplyDeleteMy guesses are Gloria Swanson or Marlene Dietrich. It's too long to copy, but if you IMDB them, some of the clues fit. I'm leaning more toward Dietrich because she was born in Germany and if only ONE member of her family found out, then it could be because they were too far away to hear any gossip. Also, she was married to a man she never divorced but only lived with him for 5 years. That could be what he meant by "in between marriages-sort of". And, she never won an Oscar either. So, I think it's her.
ReplyDeleteEnty: Will you be nice and tell us TOMORROW if any of us have guessed correctly so far?
Also, I forgot to mention in my above comment that Dietrich was known for her legs - maybe a clue to the "fine" woman comment.
ReplyDelete"'When there really wasn't a hollywood yet' would indicate someone from the silents or early talkie days. You have to go back very far for that. No one from the 20s, 40s, 50s, or 60s."
ReplyDeleteAre you crazy or just stupid?? Hollywood was very much alive during the early talkies and silent days.
This is someone who started out before all that, probably on the stage.
When is says "For this one, we need to start way back. Even really before classic Hollywood. Hell when this started there really wasn't a Hollywood yet" I think it means that she got pregnant and had the baby then, not that she got famous before Hollywood was created.
ReplyDeleteChristine marie, please read all blog comments.
ReplyDeleteSwanson came to Hollywood at 16 and ENT says that years pass, she grows into a "fine woman" (a Mae West movie quote -- also see above blogger comment) and she "finally gets to Hollywood."
Count Dietrich out -- clues lead to an American actress. Please read comments above!!!!!!!!!!!!
It's not like we have 362 comments to slog through like we did for Timmy/Shimmy and people kept asking the same questions over and over.....
I'm randomly throwing this out there - Ethel Merman... married 5 times, no oscars.
ReplyDelete"Acting was what she was most famous for, but she was probably better at other things."
Ethel had kids, but does ENTY ever say she didn't have other kids? And EM 2nd husband was a newspaper man. NO HOLLYWOOD.
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ReplyDelete"Dont believe is Gloria Swanson.She had a resolute strong personality. The kind of person capable of this is pathetic, needy of attention,with deep emotional problems."
ReplyDeleteOh, so did you know Swanson personally?
It's not Mary Pickford. She won an oscar.
ReplyDeleteMooshki:
ReplyDeleteOT, but to continue your Mae West quote off, I offer these:
"Is that a pistol in your pocket, or are ya just glad to see me?"
and the immortal "When I'm good, I'm very good, but when I'm bad, I'm better"
And for the record, I agree, this is Mae West.
(1.) The Biograph Company filmed the short film A Daring Hold-Up in Southern California in Los Angeles in 1906.
ReplyDelete(2) The first studio in the Los Angeles area was established by the Selig Polyscope Company in Edendale, with construction beginning in August 1909.
(3) the first movie ever shot in Hollywood called In Old California,
(4) In 1911, the Nestor Company opened Hollywood's first film studio .
(5) Not long thereafter Cecil B. DeMille and D. W. Griffith began making movies.
(6) The first feature film made specifically in a Hollywood studio, in 1914, was The Squaw Man,
(7) Burgeoning film industry during the 1920s and 1930s.
I think the baby was born around 1911-ish.
It's not Rosemary Clooney. First of all, Hollywood had been around for a long time by the time she was born (1928). Secondly, she is George's father's brother, not his second cousin. Thirdly the son Enty talks about does not sound like someone famous (thereby meaning he cannot be George Clooney). It sounds like he was in Hollywood for six months, hooked up with an extra, got married, and went back to his hometown.
ReplyDeleteMae West was born in 1893. Her first film was made when she was 38in 1932.
ReplyDeleteBy 1933 she was a huge film star.
IF she had the baby in her early teens -- say -- 14 -- the baby would have been born around 1907.
How old would the son have be to have this affair? If she were a major star in 1933, the son would have been around 26.
Hm.....
It's not Ava Gardner, Marilyn Monroe, Betty Grable, Lauren Bacall, or Rita Hayworth--Hollywood was well established by the time they were born.
ReplyDeleteIt's not Mae Murray--the blind says this actress is A list.
It's not Hedy Lamarr, Garbo, or Dietrich--this is clearly an American born actress!
I know everyone thinks this can't be Gloria Swanson because she came to Hollywood at 16 with her husband, but the blind does say that she was "a very young teenager" when she had the baby. "The years pass" is a vague term. That could mean 3 years or 30 years. She could have had the baby when she was 13 and come to Hollywood when she was 16 (16 was considered a woman back then). Since the blind says "Some say that the father of the baby was a man she later married," then I am assuming that when she later married her first husband, it wasn't too many years after the child was born.
ReplyDeleteAlso, wikipedia says that Swanson "didn't intend to go into show business." This matches the blind which states "Finally she ends up in Hollywood. It isn't where she was planning on going necessarily, but when she finally made it there, she made it really, really big."
I'm going to toss Myrna Loy into the mix, mostly because The Women was just remade and that might give EL a reason for thinking about her. She's from a small town in Montana and she hit big just at the end of the silent movie era. She was married four times so the "in between men" phrase fits. She ha an honorary Oscar for lifetime achievement, but she never won on her own.
ReplyDeleteNo guesses, but for what it's worth, I still think Woody Allen is bad.
ReplyDeleteI would like to agree with the Mae West guesses, but something tells me it was someone who was an A lister then, but not necessarily a name known so well now.....
I was thinking of Marion Davies.
ReplyDeletebut it turns out that she had a hidden daughter (with WRH) anyway haha
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ReplyDeleteTallulah Bankhead's wikipedia talks about how she was investigated for seducing half a dozen underage schoolboys from Eton College while in Britain.
ReplyDeletehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tallulah_Bankhead#MI5_investigation_of_Eton_school_scandal
It makes sense that it was Mae West because:
ReplyDeleteShe was born at the right time (1893) amd could have given birth before Hollywood was really Hollywood.
"Acting was what she was most famous for, but she was probably better at other things"--she was probably a better writer than actress.
"she was in between marriages. Kind of"--West was a bigamist. She was married to two men at the same time.
How about Jeanette MacDonald? The "in between marriages. Kind of" comment could refer to the fact that she kept going back in forth between her husband, Gene Raymond, and lover (her onscreen husband/lover), Nelson Eddy.
ReplyDeleteAlso, MacDonald would have been better at singing than acting.
ReplyDeleteFrom Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
ReplyDeleteGloria Swanson
Swanson grew up mainly in Puerto Rico, Chicago, and Key West, Florida. Gloria didn't intend to go into show business. After her formal education in the Chicago school system and elsewhere, she began work in a department store as a sales clerk.
Gloria had 6 husbands and when one husband divorced her he charged her with adultery with 13 men. Had a open affair with Joe Kennedy and also admitted to an abortion.
Married her first husband at the age of 17.
i'm thinking "classic hollywood" is actually a little later. when did the name get changed from "hollywoodland" for starters?
ReplyDeletewhen i think hollywood classic, i think the big, lavish pictures, the musicals, what would that be, the '30s?
that could put a slightly different spin on this.
and also, definitely yuck, but stuff like that DID happen. there was a lot of incest going on, and it wasn't just in the deep south. and if you put this incident in the above time frame, when the excesses of hollywood actually BECAME the excesses, it might explain this "illicit affair".
AND, maybe she was headed to new york, as a dancer, the rockettes? that would fit in with the big budget musicals.
that's it, that's all my wittle bwain can come up with.
Mooshki:
ReplyDeleteFor the Mae West Quote-Off, I humbly submit my favorite:
"I ain't no model...a model's just an imitation of the real thing"
For the BI:
Theda Bara. From Ohio, born in 1855. The biggest star of her time, behind Charlie Chaplin and Mary Pickford, but because she has more films missing from her oeuvre than any other actress with a star on the walk of fame, her name doesn't have the recognition, though she was seriously A-list. She never won an Oscar, and she was most famous as a femme fatale/vamp. Specifically, she was famous for her transparent costumes in her films, before the "film codes" banned them.
Interesting factoid that ties in: The name "Theda Bara" was a stage name, her real name was "Theodosia Goodman" When she became hugely famous her entire family changed their last name to "Bara" from "Goodman" which reminds me of her family "Always wanting a piece of this actress" as Enty says. Her sister even tried to become an actress, using the name "Laurie Bara"
Thing that doesn't fit: she was only married once. So "in between marriages, sort of.." would have to mean that she and the husband were separated, but never divorced, and she ended up going back to him (separated is "sort of" in between being married and not, and the "new" marriage would have to be the "old" marriage with the separation rescinded...and I have to admit that is a weak theory...)
this is so difficult, could be so many of the really big stars. I think we have to look at it logically. (yes, I'm avoiding real work here - I have a report due!)
ReplyDeletethe clues -
our A list actress was 13 to 14ish 'before classic hollywood' - to me, classic hollywood is mid-1930s to mid 1940s. Post-WWII films were so different. So, someone who was really big in that era, and who remained a huge name throughout her life.
Never won an Oscar, but was in at least one Oscar-nominated film.
Needed the company of men, preferably a lot of men (okay, that's more difficult, because who knows privately?)
Hollywood "wasn't necessarily where she was planning on going necessarily" - so probably, had a career in some other arm of show business before landing in Hollywood.
"But when she finally made it there, she made it really, really big" - so this is someone who made it in Hollywood either older than most actresses usually did, or who had a successful career elsewhere and got there, again, a little later than most.
Our actress was "in a movie theatre each week" - so, 'big' big.
An actress who resisted aging, and needed to brag about her conquests. (again, so many possibles!)
"Acting was what she was most famous for, but she was probably better at other things." Sounds like a sexual innuendo, yes? But, if it's not, then we have a multi-talented woman here. Someone who was perhaps a writer, a producer, a creative businesswoman, as well as a hugely successful actress.
So my guesses were:
Ava Gardner
Joan Crawford (elim due to Oscar)
Hedy Lamarr (invented high tech)
BUT!! I confess that I've gone over to the Mae West camp - and this is why -
Mae West had a successful vaudeville career (started at the age of 12) before her movie career. Her first movie contract was in 1932, when Mae was 38. And she immediately became a huge film star by 1933, when she was the largest box office draw in the US.
Mae West wrote most of "My Little Chickadee" but her studio forced her to give W.C. Fields a co-writing credit, even though he only wrote one scene.
Mae had a successful vaudeville career before finally getting to Hollywood in her 30's (also in the 1930s, ha!), and she almost instantly became a huge star.
Wrote, produced and directed plays that were successful but pretty naughty. went to jail for 10 days for it. Wrote plays throughout her life.
Wrote her own roles throughout her movie career, and was hugely successful.
constantly surrounded herself by men, well into her 80s. Needed the facade of perpetual youth and sex appeal.
I'm sold, I think it's Mae. But I can be convinced otherwise with a good counter argument!!
"That's HEDLEY..."
ReplyDelete(Sorry. Couldn't resist. By the way, this is one of the best BIs EVAH!)
I'm going with the Mae West or Gloria Swanson guess, although Myrna Loy is a very interesting conjecture. Most of the other guesses are for actresses who would have been too young.
ReplyDeleteCount me on the Mae West band wagon.
ReplyDeleteto the person above who commented about "classic hollywood" producing "big, lavish pictures"; seriously read up on the silent film era. the stuff they turned out later (30's-50's) can't compare to some of the silent products.
Can't be Ava Gardner. She won Oscars.
ReplyDeleteslippy - I totally agree, sort of. I'm a fan of the 30s to 40s films. not a huge silent fan. But the ironic thing is that Hollywood felt sort of forced to bring in censors because the late 20s - early 30s films were pretty suggestive, bordering on pretty naughty. satin gowns with no bras or undies, see-through, fan dances, etc. Pretty wild!
ReplyDeleteTallulah Bankhead. There were always rumors about her running away from home pregnant by her daddy back home in Alabama.
ReplyDeleteMy vote is for Tallulah Bankhead.
ReplyDeleteBoth she and her sister were pretty wild.
She always bragged about her conquests.
She was warped when it came to sex- even candidly talked about being raped at age 11. When she had a hysterectomy due to gonorrhea, she told the doctor "don't think this has taught me a lesson."
She was from Huntsville, AL.
Was in an academy nominated film-Lifeboat.
Was married once at age 35-39. To John Emery from New York. She spent time in New York when she was 15.
Was very sexually open- I could see her slipping up about the conquest with the son.
Was A list, but primarily known for her stage roles.
oh...my...good god....i know who it is for SURE
ReplyDeletehttp://lampshademusic.typepad.com
"Can't be Ava Gardner. She won Oscars."
ReplyDeleteOh yeah? Do you mean in a previous life?
"Was married once at age 35-39. To John Emery from New York."
ReplyDeleteSo she was married once. Ok genius, go ahead and explain to me how someone can be "inbetween marriages" when they've only been married ONE TIME!!!!
LOL, Stephe! Thanks for that.
ReplyDeleteCan't decide between Mae West and Tallulah B.
An old Bankhead story:
Guy: Miss Bankhead, may I have a nickel to call my friend?
T: Here's a dime. Call them all!
Anyway, they were both pistols though I think Mae appeared more controlled in her behavior. But then again, there's the "fine woman" quote which I think is a huge clue.
ACK!
I agree with delcodave. Enty got this from Jack Valenti. In the Timmy posts he referred to his source as JJ, and Jack Valenti's middle name was Joseph.
ReplyDeleteSince apparently she told this story directly to Ent's source, who would Jack Valenti have known?
Just a little extra info on the mae west wagon.
ReplyDelete* Mae's father was a huge fisted horse merchant who had New York mob connections and who struck fear into many.
*Mae was his pride and joy and he doted on her every whim far more than his other daughter. Even her mother commented often on her fathers obvious and over the top affection for Mae
*Mae admitted losing her virginity at 11 and stated that she had sex with every neighbourhood boy she could, she even went into details about the sponge she used as birth control at this time. (What most enlightened people know today is that sexual acting out in a child this young is a good indication of sexual abuse.
* No expense was spared when Mae decided to pursue a career in vaudeville (believe it or not at one time she was actually a male impersonator)however while she remained deeply devoted to her father she didn't see him much after the age of around 17. Is this because someone in her family tried to prevent it?
*Mae believed that orgasms were essential for her daily health and insisted on having at least 1 a day. She had few scruples but wouldn't be considered kinky by todays standards, just insatiable....exactly how we now classify a sex addict.
*She took many lovers and loved to have men fight over her, Mae wouldn't have thought it was too bad to do this blind item. She would have considered it a healthy form of self expression. She often adnitted that she had no mothering instinct at all.If she had a son, she would never have treated him like one. (Sorry I'm a bit of a Mae West expert)
I m a new poster and love the old hollywood stars and films!
ReplyDeleteIt's not Ava Gardner: she hadnt made a name for herself before she came to Hollywood (no stage credits etc, she got an MGM contract straight away).
It could be Tallulah Bankhead. M15 investigated her having immoral conduct with boys from Eton and it also said: "was thrown out of her home by her father because of immoral conduct" (pregnancy?)
Still the best guess is Mae West. She made a name for herself on the stage, no one expected a 30 something to still make it big in Hollywood, she was really really big. She really took the filmworld by storm and was the highest paid actress in the US for a while. Also i saw a documentary on her and there were loads of guys hanging around her. She needed to be adored and surrounded herself with a lot of gay men.
PLus the timeframe fits. She could have had the kid before 'Hollywood became Hollywood', the kid would have been in late teens/early twenties when 'aunt' is on the screen each week.
No kanonymous i havent met Gloria Swanson personally. I believe you dont have to met the person you write about. Otherwise no one could write books about Napoleon!
ReplyDeleteEveryone thinks Mae West or Talullah. Thing is both liked to create and enlarge their own mythos, so i would not believe this story as a real one, or that bad. Maybe flirting and having a kiss or two, but 6 months....too over the top.
Crazy old Hollywood folks!! If Joan Crawford wasnt a Oscar winner i would say it was her!
Mae Murray was married 4 times, had a son at an advanced age that one of her relatives ( or old days friends) took care, but this was a well known son, his father was "Prince" David Mdivani, one con artist.
It mus be one of those "jazz babies". If Barbara Lamar died before entering 30, so it wanst her....
Yay! Some people are on the Tallulah train!
ReplyDeleteThe key to solving this one is - who would TELL IT? Sure, it COULD have happened to all of those that are listed here, but most of these women would have DIED before admitting they had sex with their son, knowing it was their son, multiple times.
ReplyDeleteAnna....what do you think of the theory that Mae West was a man? Take a look at her: big wrists, legs always covered up and a smirk that said "I've got a secret!" That's why she was always surrounded by those hunky guys.
ReplyDeleteI'm on the Tallulah wagon. She was batshit crazy and willing to have sex with anything that moved.
Just asking.
This is still on my mind. Having sex with your own child (grown or not) is depravity of the highest order, only torturers and serial killers are higher on my list. It is also extremely rare for a woman to commit this sort of act, so rare it almost doesn't exist statistically. Being a peen-loving slut doesn't even compare. We're looking for someone who is almost totally without conscience.
ReplyDeleteIMO, Mae West was a fun-loving slut who enjoyed life.
kanonymous said...
ReplyDelete"'When there really wasn't a hollywood yet' would indicate someone from the silents or early talkie days. You have to go back very far for that. No one from the 20s, 40s, 50s, or 60s."
Are you crazy or just stupid?? Hollywood was very much alive during the early talkies and silent days.
This is someone who started out before all that, probably on the stage.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Before you start calling people stupid, why don't you READ and INTERPRET better? Nothing I wrote leaves out someone from the stage or indicates Hollywood was not going on in the silents and early talkie days. I was trying in a polite way to let others know that their guesses about Marilyn Monroe etc. did not fit the timeframe of the blind. Because people guess and don't READ. Which apparently you're familiar with.
kanonymous, I see you are a troll who enjoys being an @sshole. Go back under your bridge.
ReplyDeleteFor what it's worth, Kay Francis started out on the stage and had 10 abortions. She was very free sexually (obviously) and I can see her telling someone about it, but she was only A list back in the 30s and lost her status to the point where people hardly know who she is these days.
ReplyDeleteokay...im on the mae west bandwagon and i thought id share this with you guys...one of my friends has these mae quotes on her myspace and its pretty much just a bunch of them combined in a paragraph...they kind of say mae was the type of woman who was capable of this blind:
ReplyDeleteMine is a story, i wrote myself, about a girl who lost her reputation, but never missed it. And when girls go bad, guys just follow... You may have heard about me, but honey, you can't prove a thing. I believe that it's better to be looked over than it is to be overlooked. I'm a woman of very few words, but lots of action. It isn't what I do, but how I do it. It isn't what I say, but how I say it, and How I look when i do it and say it. When I'm good I'm very, very good, but when I'm bad, I'm better. Between to evils, I always pic the one never tried before. See, i'm your typical rockabilly lady, with a touch of class, but, make no mistake, i could kick your ass. If you cross me, i garauntee, you'll never do it again. If you can make me laugh, you can make me fall in love. But a woman in love can't be reasonable, or else she wouldn't be in love, now would she. i have to admit, i'm a sucker for a man who knows what he wants, and isn't affraid to get it. Then again, i know what i want, and if you're involved, you're a lucky so and so. A hard man is good to find. All discarded lovers should be given a second chance, but with somebody else. I only have 'yes' men around me. Who needs 'no' men. I never loved another person the way I loved myself. I'll try anything once, twice if I like it, three times to make sure. It takes two to get one in trouble, sex is emotion in motion. The score never interested me, only the game. They say a man's kiss is his signature, and i'm collecting Johnny Hancocks until i find the one that's signed, sincerely to me. Any time you got nothing to do- and lots of time to do it- come on up....
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ReplyDeletekanonymous, you are very fresh.
ReplyDeleteNotice I didn't call you stupid or 'genius', I pointed out your rude behavior.
Take a nap or a deep breath or whatever you need so you don't feel you have to put down others to prove your points. Which are only opinions, anyway.
This public politeness message has been brought to you by a grown up. Thank you.
the spelling errors are my friends lol...i just copied and pasted!
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI love it when you share these stories Ent - Thank you!
ReplyDeleteI LOVE OLD HOLLYWOOD BI ENTY's.
ReplyDeleteKeep them coming Boo.
As for my guess, Mae,or Gloria.
Don't think its Talullah since she came from old money and she could easily afford an illegal/pricey abortion.
"Before you start calling people stupid, why don't you READ and INTERPRET better? Nothing I wrote leaves out someone from the stage or indicates Hollywood was not going on in the silents and early talkie days."
ReplyDeleteI didn't say that either. Maybe you should read and interpret better--exactly the point I was trying to get across before.
"Having sex with your own child (grown or not) is depravity of the highest order, only torturers and serial killers are higher on my list . . . We're looking for someone who is almost totally without conscience."
ReplyDeleteYou have to remember, we're not talking about a pedophile here. This was a grown woman having sex with a grown man (who, although he didn't know she was his mother, DID know that she was a blood relative of his). While I think the whole thing is disgusting, I wouldn't put her in the ranks with serial killers and torturers.
"kanonymous, I see you are a troll who enjoys being an @sshole. Go back under your bridge."
ReplyDeleteThis is an open discussion on an entertainment blog. Please don't take things so seriously. This is supposed to be fun.
I really appreciate all the hard work and research some of you are doing. And just about all the guesses sound great and plausible.
ReplyDeleteI just have a sinking feeling that once all the really famous household names get used up as guesses, its going to be someone a little more obscure and less obvious. This is just my thinking based on timmy/shimmy experience.
but i am really enjoying this and am enjoying your comments. thank you so much. my friends and I have already had lengthy discussions and have been combing the internet ourselves.
have a great day everyone.
Baba Charna said...
ReplyDeleteI think it's Hedy Lamarr.
That's Hedley! :P
For all you people who think it's Tallulah Bankhead, please explain this part of the blind in relationship to her: "At the time he showed up, she was in between marriages. Kind of."
ReplyDeleteI'm starting to lean towards Mae West. I seam to remember hearing somewhere that she was a kinky broad. Everybody's clues really fit her, too.
ReplyDeleteMae West fer sure.
ReplyDeleteClassic Hollywood started in 1910, so if you read this blind correctly Enty is saying she was pregnant before this time. When the kid came to Hollywood, he must have been what - 18? I'm saying that we're looking for an actress who was famous between 1920-1925. And if she was a 'very young teen' when pregnant, she's probably around 32 at that time.
ReplyDeleteNow I have to go double check all of your guesses.
I think Ava Gardner was too young for this blind. I like ragdoll's guess of Theda Bara.
ReplyDeleteMooshki, et al :
ReplyDelete"It's better to be looked over than overlooked."
:)
ANd i agree with everyone else--kanonymous, you're being pretty mean for no reason. We're all friends here.
A question to all:
ReplyDeleteShould we assume that the actress in question is deceased?
I have a guess of a living individual. I checked the wikipedia site and so much lines up...
(and I am sure a lot doesnt. but the overlapping marriages with the tagline "kind of" really has me exploring it. as well as the A-list during her Hollywood career and better known for other things...)
And I am cringing at the thought of guessing someone who is still alive.
S.T.B.
David, come on! You won't get sued for guessing. Who's S.T.B.? It's too late for me to figure it out.
ReplyDeletei need to delete that. its a cut and paste error and I cant figure out how to delete. my apologies.
ReplyDeleteOh, Enty. You have the best clues.
ReplyDeleteYou are all right and it's totally Mae West. Not only does she match up with the timeline I proved above, but Kanonymous mentioned it first:
"She was in between marriages. Kind of."
She had officially divorced her husband Guido Deiro in 1920, but was still legally married to her first husband Frank Wallace whom she married in 1909 but it didn't come out until 1935. So she was "kind of" in between marriages.
Plus, if she met him in 1909 it would work for him to "possibly" be the father to this child. And Anna is right that people who exhibit such sexual promiscuity at a young age are often children of abuse, hence the father could have been a member of her own family.
Great blind Enty!
Wait, according to imdb Mae West was only married once.
ReplyDelete*Ok genius, go ahead and explain to me how someone can be "inbetween marriages" when they've only been married ONE TIME!!!!*
ReplyDeletegeez, why the attitude? keep it up and you'll have to be placed under arrest for gratuitous use of exclamation points.
I wish I could believe this one, but I just can't. Shimmy/Timmy was too much of a let down.
ReplyDelete"It is also extremely rare for a woman to commit this sort of act, so rare it almost doesn't exist statistically."
ReplyDelete"...there was a lot of incest going on, and it wasn't just in the deep south..."
Don't you guys watch Springer/
Maury? :) Seriously, there is a hell of a lot of incest going on all of the time. It doesn't get reported or talked about much, but it's a basic fact of life. And it's certainly far less common to have women offenders, but it happens. My mom's a child psychologist, and if you could hear some of her stories...
Delurking just to say how much I freaking LOVE IT when you guys go all detective-y and start helping each other figure these blinds out. I love reading your comments more than reading the blinds!! And, with the exception of kanonymous and his/her terribly mean and condescending remarks, everyone here treats each other with respect, and that's very refreshing. All friends here! BTW, I think it's Mae West, based strictly on the comments I've read here today.
ReplyDelete*our A list actress was 13 to 14ish 'before classic hollywood' - to me, classic hollywood is mid-1930s to mid 1940s. Post-WWII films were so different. So, someone who was really big in that era*
ReplyDeletehowever, the key word here is BEFORE. so, even by your definition, the timeframe is BEFORE the mid-1930's to mid-1940's. the blind goes on to further clarify, though, that "hell, when this started, there really wasn't a hollywood yet." despite our own various and personal definitions of when classic hollywood might have truly been, this seems to ratchet the timeframe back to the very early 20th century, or even the late 19th. what's more, since the blind also states that the actress in question had her child when she was a very young teenager -- a description that we can probably infer meaning that she was 16 or younger -- then we can deduce *adjusting deerstalker* that the birth took place no later than ... oh, 1910, or 1912. and the actress' hollywood career was probably in full swing by 1920 or so. *tunes violin, sniffs cocaine*
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ReplyDeleteAMD & *girl:
ReplyDelete*technically* both wiki (twice married)and IMDB (once married) are right, because although she took vows tow separate times, with two separate husbands, only the first is legal if there was no divorce prior to the second (marriage). Bigamy was illegal back then too.
*Wait, according to imdb Mae West was only married once.*
ReplyDeletewell, imdb isn't infallible. even if they're right, though, it's possible that, since ms. west was still married to her first husband at the time that she married her second husband, her second marriage was invalid, meaning that, technically, she was only married ... once.
my money's on mae for this one, too, although i think tallulah bankhead, gloria swanson, and even joan crawford (who was far older than she pretended to be), are all good guesses. initially, i thought "mary pickford!" because of the hint about the man-who-was-the-possible-father being unable to marry her at the time, although she later married him, i.e., douglas fairbanks, but she was an oscar-winner, so she's banished to the sidelines. i briefly thought harlow -- but since she was so young when she died, she doesn't fit the "as she aged" qualification.
clara bow was reportedly raped by her father when she was 14 or 15, and she was mentally unstable and apparently sexually indiscriminate later in her life, as well, so she fits some of the criteria for this blind. no oscar wins, but she was A-list for most of her career -- since she started off big and her career was effectively ended by the advent of sound in motion pictures. she was known as the "It" girl, too, so ... she was recognized as much for her image and the "jazz-baby" lifestyle she portrayed as the films she made. but were any of her films nominated for the academy award? dunno. dunno much about theda bara, either, but what i've read here was interesting.
Well, lets see
ReplyDeleteMae West : was old enough, started in New York , always pursued a carreer in show business ( but on Broadway)never won an Oscar and managed to work steadly, not always in Hollywood though ( she had a great chance to play the whorehouse owner in Gone with the wind when her carreer was in dangerous, declined the part and went to Las Vegas, but made Los Angeles her home) and was married twice.
Tallulah : was old enough, but all her life was pretty well known and she always wanted to go Hollywood. She was married just once.
Joan Crawford : old enough, was there at the right time, could have done, but won an Oscar.
Theda Bara : was old enough for sure. Her family was a good jewish one, she went to College, i could see her giving a child for under that circustamces, but she was only married once.
Hedy Lamarr : A smart, intelligent woman. Not the kind that thought with the pussy. And had an open, public life since her late tweend
Clara Bow : She was famous in her late tweens, so she wanst a fine woman at the time. And her carreer was over pretty fast
Barbara Lamarr : crazy and hot mess, but died too young.
May Murray : The most pathetic, attention seeker Hollywood ever had. Was old enough, married 4 times, started on Broadway.
Mary Pickford : Another smart woman with high standars , always slept and married with well known people in the business, and won an Oscar.
Lilian Gish : A puritan. And was always a performer.
Constance Bennet : Was old enough, never won an Oscar, was really famous ,lile a Cate Blanchet of the time ( always well dressed, never a box office hit), married millions of times and was pretty wild.
Maybe yes, Maybe not
I think we are missing something
Right, kanonymous, because words like "stupid" and "crazy" directed towards other posters could never be taken seriously!
ReplyDeleteBy the way, is Ent giving us enough info :) hehehe
ReplyDeletewestward ho...i think before Hollywood existed can be interpreted in many ways. But the literal way is sometime before the 20´s, when the Studios and Stars system were not what we consider the "classic" one. Before 20´s lots of films were being produced in New York, but only in the 20´s all the studios were based in California
For those who havent already checked, I found moviemaidens.com a good starting point
ReplyDeleteJust ignore him/her/it, impertinent vixon. Kanonymous is rude and doesn't deserve anyone's time.
ReplyDeleteya, priscila -- that's actually what i was trying to say. lol. :D
ReplyDeleteJust wanna say keep up the good work!
ReplyDeleteI dont even venture a guess on Old HW....just listen to yours!
I'm with priscilla, I think there's something we're missing here.
ReplyDeleteMaybe "she was one hell of a matchmaker" is a clue? Could it be a reference to a theater/movie title or part she played?
It is interesting to note that Mae West wrote an unproduced auto-biographical play called The Hussy.
ReplyDeleteGolden Age of Hollywood: From the end of the silent era in American cinema in the late 1920s to the late 1950s.
Important clues:
ReplyDelete1. Acting was what she was most famous for, but she was probably better at other things.
2. It isn't where she was planning on going necessarily, but when she finally made it there, she made it really, really big.
3. A list actress
Not to sidetrack people here, but I've read somewhere that it is not uncommon for people to develop sexual relations with close relatives they never grew up with. Daughters with fathers, sons with mothers -- I've even read about a gay brother separated from his straight brother doing the nasty with him.
ReplyDeleteOf course, I have no reference/proof of any this so-called reading material. Just snippets I've read here and there.
It seems that whatever incestual taboos that could have happened if people grew up together, didn't develop because of the time spent apart all of their lives.
That being said, when did Enty marry 2 more women? I thought he was on wife #4 last time he mentioned it?
Hi - first time poster here so go easy on me.
ReplyDeleteWhat about Paulette Goddard? She sprang immediately to mind for me. Lots of classy, nominated films but no awards for herself; lots of juicy marriages (including Chaplin - perhaps the baby daddy who she later married?) Check her out on Wikipedia - a very interesting lady.
Brenda, I think Goddard is too young. The baby was supposed to have been born before there was even a Hollywood yet, according to ENT.
ReplyDeleteThe baby would have been born around 1910, the year Goddard was born.
Mae West supposedly had an affair in the 30s with a boxer turned chauffer (hers) with Albert "Chalky" Wright, who was born in 1912.
ReplyDeleteHowever, she denied a romance, although she did help him revive his career in order to help him meet his family's financial obligations. She bought a house for his mother and showered him with gifts.
Janele, Enty had a busy spring. He jumped from #4 to #6 around June, I think? I just wish he'd tell us some stories of his trips to Mexico for the quickie divorces. :)
ReplyDeleteEnty, if I become Wife #7, will I get the answers to half of the BIs when we divorce? You can keep the basement.
ReplyDeleteHalf of the *unrevealed* BIs, I mean.
ReplyDeleteI'll bring pastries.
I think it's Mae West too. It would make sense that she would be reluctant to make movies since she was already successful on the stage and would be entering into new territory. I think the baby was born in 1911 or 1912 and her son visited her in about 1932.
ReplyDeleteOooh and also Mae West started on Broadway in 1911 and lasted for ONE WEEK on the stage. Perhaps she quit that show because she found out she was pregnant?
ReplyDeleteJanele, he's already got #7 lined up, so you'll have to wait for #8. Luckily, with his record, that should only be a few months.
ReplyDeletehmmm..
ReplyDeleteLets take a look at the timeline...
I would put around 1905 as the limit of our actress birth.She could have got pregnant when she was 13,14 years old (When our actress was still a very young teenager), so still before the 20´s.
After the pregnancy and still young she started working, not yet in films. I assume, since he said she had not planed at first to reach Hollywood, that she took the cliché path at the time for a young pretty woman(and still now??) with model gigs, chorus girl and vaudeville. Something in the business, but not drama related.
She could have arrived in Hollywood somewhen around 1924.
So let´s say around 1939 her son arrives there too. he would be nearly 20´s, she in her middle 30´s.She was still at that time working or living in Hollywood and introduced his son to a extra in one of her movies.
Basically we have two possible timelines. One gets Mae West, Swanson, May Murray etc
The other timeline i was thinking could fit Talullah, Constance Bennet etc.
The Chaplin leading ladies, lovers and wifes ( at least two of them) could fit for the last timeline. But Mildred Davis, Lita Grey and even Paulette Goddard were not at all big stars...
My God i am totally obssessed with that!
have we considered merle oberon? it's a long shot, but she was ashamed of her family, her mother being from india, and she was quite the hot shot at the indian night clubs. she was nominated for an oscar in 1935.
ReplyDeleteaccording to IMDB, she married one of the three korda brothers, who were all in the movie business. the part i found interesting was her NEPHEW, vincent wrote two books about the three brothers and their wives and "he had been "more than usually circumspect on the subject of Merle" when he wrote 'Charmed Lives', but Merle's lawyer had reviewed the bound galley proofs and called. Korda, faced with a "time-consuming and expensive lawsuit," took Oberon "virtually out of the book altogether."
she was married 4 times and adopted 2 children.
if she had become pregnant in india, she would have definitely not kept a baby she would have been ashamed of.
she was born in 1911.
oh, and the ocscars didn't start until 1927.
BUUUUTTT, and it's a big one, i'm really grasping at straws here. and i can't find anything other than acting she was famous for except for a shady past.
wiki has some other stuff, but you know how reliable they are.
it was just a someone else i threw out there.
i am trying to figure out this line:
ReplyDelete"This is about an A list actress for almost all of her career. Acting was what she was most famous for, but she was probably better at other things."
To me, this means A-list actress had her status based on name recognition, popularity and steady work in high profile films. (back then, not now)
However, she is also well-known for another reason that may or may not do with the entertainment field.
SPORTS:
Vera Ruba Ralston
Esther Williams
PHILANTHROPY:
Shriley Temple
DANCING:
Ginger Rogers
VAUDEVILLE
SINGING
I am not saying these 4 guesses are good guesses. I looked them up, there are some loop holes that negate them (and some remarkable coincidences that link them to this blind!) But I am dissecting that line the best I can by coming up with categories.
Anyone else wanna throw out some "better at other things" categories?
Merle Oberon was Europa based, not Hollywood based. Perhaps too young, but of course form a shady background.
ReplyDeleteHer last husband was Audrey Hepburn´s last husband too!
Oscar or no Oscar, before I even finished the third paragraph Joan Crawford's face appeared in my mind.
ReplyDeleteI am leaning towards someone a little more obscure than all the "big guns" that were named here.
ReplyDeleteOnly because... if this gets revealed, and it is someone SO BIG its going to get the trash rags involved and running sensationalized stories.
(even tho i like the Mae West guess)
How about Billie Burke?
Molly Picon? She was born in 1898 and she played Yente, the matchmaker, in the movie FIDDLER ON THE ROOF. I can't see her doing this, though. And I guess she wasn't A-list. But the matchmaker part and the age fit.
ReplyDeleteBillie Burke came from an artistic family. I believe circus or so. Not sure....Ent said she made it BIG...
ReplyDeletemust be an A lister, otherwise wich influence she could use to get her son into business??it would not make sense....
delcodave, i could see Mae West being better in writing her material than in acting; Swanson wrote and was a fine artist too; Mae Murray was first of all a dancer...
Most the women in show business that time were not only actresses. Ent let us believed she had some kind of success in another venues before.
We could also consider she was known for other qualities. Or Ent was sarcastic about, meaning she wasnt that good at acting, but was better in sleeping with the right people....
Priscilla,
ReplyDeletereally like your last post. yeah, i am just brainstorming and throwing things out there.
i spent over an hour on the phone today with a hollywood film buff friend going over this and throwing tons of names back and forth. he's really getting into it too.
I do like the Mae West answer. A LOT. But I also think we should play devils advocate and keep searching and exploring other examples.
I am thinking the "better" line is SINGER or ATHLETE. Trying to look up women who were in Talkies and made the transition over to Film.
ps. i also thought about a sarcastic slant as well.
here's another interesting guess:
ReplyDeletelana turner.
read the wiki entry on her (yeah, wiki, i know) but what was she most famous for? the sweater girl, being "discovered" at the soda fountain. made tons of movies, 8 marriages, always had men around. maybe a little old, but still possible.
i also was thinking jane russell, she of the famous boobies :)!
actually, it was the boobie thing that got me started on this track, the "sweater girls".
oh, and priscilla, merle started in europe, but also made films here. as i said, it was a reach, but it was a new name to throw out there.
i'm just afraid the mae west guess is too easy. reading through the blind the first time i thought clara bow, but i still think that's too early. i think this is more likely someone we're going to be surprised at the answer.
ARRGH! i hate that i'm so bad at these!
"You have to remember, we're not talking about a pedophile here. This was a grown woman having sex with a grown man (who, although he didn't know she was his mother, DID know that she was a blood relative of his). While I think the whole thing is disgusting, I wouldn't put her in the ranks with serial killers and torturers."
ReplyDeleteI totally disagree. This person had sex with a man that she knew was her son multiple times in an unbelievably deceptive circumstance. You could ALMOST forgive it if it were a one-time drunken/drugged encounter, but she did it over and over, apparently just for the thrill of being in that situation. There's a big difference between screwing your super-famous 2nd cousin and screwing your mother. The guy didn't have a clue in this world.
I'm sorry, but knowingly abusing your child (grown or not) like that is just plain evil. It shows a total lack of morals, a complete disregard for the mental health of your offspring, and pathological sexual deviancy.
bionic bunny! and decodave
ReplyDeleteIt is 1 in the morning here and i cant go to sleep!!I agree that Mae West would be the easiest answer.
What i tried to say it is, if the answer is Mae Westm then i know it is not true. She was not a compulsive lier, but she enjoyed make up stories to enlance her reputation.
I know Merle Oberon made movies in Hollywood,and had a shady past, but i am not sure she was that wild...
Kay Francis was a good bet too. She fits the timeline.
Not sure, but i would put my money on Mae Murray though.Bitch was craaazy jazz baby.
I was reading...Corinne Grifith was also pretty crazy. Wikipedia tells the story when she was in her 60´s she claimed in court she wanst herself, but a 20 years younger cousin!!! Priceless...
Hi CDAN,
ReplyDeleteSomebody told me to take a looksee here.
However there appears to be nothing to see except some words with a very high creep factor.
Enjoy all!
Lovingly yours,
DP
JACKSONVILLE, Fla. — Before there was Hollywood, there was Jacksonville.
ReplyDeleteOliver Hardy made his debut film there in 1913's "Outwitting Daddy." The first feature-length color film produced in the U.S. -- the 1917 release "The Gulf Between" -- was filmed in Jacksonville.
It even was the birthplace of Metro Pictures, which later merged with other production houses to become Metro-Goldwyn-Mayer, or MGM.
Dubbed the "World's Winter Film Capital" a century ago when Kalem Pictures moved its offseason production here to escape New York winters, Jacksonville once had more than 30 studios
http://www.usatoday.com/life/movies/2008-09-05-118465882_x.htm
This bring up the point of short reels- In the theater every week...
hmmm
Grace, I don't know who you are, but I don't have to read the comments to give my guess. Screw you. My guess is just as good as anyone elses here and if you don't like what you read - keep it to yourself. I'm sick of you people coming on this board and acting like you own it.
ReplyDeleteAnd what clues specify that this is an American actress? People came from various countries to America. Is is so outlandish that someone from a foreign country would end up in Hollywood? Keep your opinion of people's guesses to yourself.